Wikipedia talk:Twinkle

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Default behaviour of CSD logging

It took me some fiddling around, looking at other people's CSD logs to figure out that they're not manually added, but typically via Twinkle. That said, CSD logging is disabled by default in Wikipedia:Twinkle/Preferences § Speedy.

It wasn't clear to me if I needed to create User:Shushugah/CSD log manually or if it would be created automatically once setting is enabled. If automatic, are there any defaults, e.g archiving set up? Is there a good reason not to make this a default setting with automatic creation the first time an editor nominates article for speedy deletion? ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 13:31, 18 September 2024 (UTC)

I would support opt-out rather than the current opt-in for CSD/PROD logging. Primefac (talk) 18:35, 18 September 2024 (UTC)

I concur, default on with opt-out makes more sense to me. KylieTastic (talk) 12:16, 19 September 2024 (UTC)

This is easy to code, but could get some pushback once deployed. Hopefully some more talk page watchers can chime in with their thoughts before we commit to doing this. –Novem Linguae (talk) 21:15, 19 September 2024 (UTC)

We've discussed this before: /Archive 47#csd/prod/xfd: turn on userspace logging by default. Nardog (talk) 21:26, 19 September 2024 (UTC)

I read the older discussion, but I am not persuaded by the reasonable expectation of privacy. Any edits created on Wikipedia is irrevocably released and typically searchable by any other editors. In the current implementation, if a CSD tag is declined, that would be permanently visible in edit history of that page as well as a user's edit. If someone is so concerned about privacy, that their declined CSD tags become visible they should not engage in CSD tagging to begin with. All that said, they still would be able to turn off the logs setting and request WP:U1 deletion. ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 10:23, 20 September 2024 (UTC)

I don't do CSDs or PRODs very often, so not really affected; i do remember trying to work out why they weren't being recorded automatically many years ago, as Shushugah seems to be referring to. Seems to me that opt-out would be more sensible for both these logs. Happy days, ~ Lindsay^Hello 13:20, 1 October 2024 (UTC)

Per Nardog this is not really a setting intended to be default-on. I think we should instead make the option more discoverable, such as by placing a footer link "Enable CSD logging" leading straight to the option on the pref page, for users who don't already have it enabled. – SD0001 (talk) 00:46, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

Question About What Warning to Issue

In an XFD discussion, I entered a Keep !vote, and the nominator struck out the bolded Keep with an explanation. My question is what Twinkle warning can or should I issue. I gave a Level 3 warning for Disruptive Editing, but I would have preferred to give something more specific. Robert McClenon (talk) 18:50, 19 September 2024 (UTC)

More generally, if I would like to propose that a new Twinkle warning be added, is this the place to make the suggestion, or should I make it somewhere else? Robert McClenon (talk) 18:50, 19 September 2024 (UTC)

Twinkle only exposes some of the standard warnings available - see Wikipedia:Template index/User talk namespace for more. Not sure if any more precise warning exists, but I think "Disruptive Editing" is very accurate if they remove an opposing !vote without a clear and valid reason. KylieTastic (talk) 18:54, 19 September 2024 (UTC)

I'd use one of the Uw-tvp* templates. "Refactoring other's talk page comments". Example: {{Uw-tpv3}}. I found it by going to TW -> Warn, then clicking on the dropdown box with all the user warnings. There's a spot to search. I typed "talk", and if that didn't work, I was going to try searching for "tpo". –Novem Linguae (talk) 21:17, 19 September 2024 (UTC)

I saw "Refactoring other's talk page comments" and didn't know if striking the Keep was refactoring. Maybe I will use it next time, but maybe there won't be a next time, because I think that this is the first time I have seen that behavior, and it should be the last time.

They didn't remove an opposing !vote. They struck it. The principle is the same.

The editor deleted my warning, so they saw it and have been warned. Thank you. Robert McClenon (talk) 17:50, 20 September 2024 (UTC)

 Closing without action –Novem Linguae (talk) 12:12, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

Where is warn entry?

I don't see the "warn" entry, how to fix? Susbush (talk) 17:43, 23 September 2024 (UTC)

@Susbush. Are you on a user or user talk page? Do you see the TW menu? When you click that open do you see the "Warn" link? –Novem Linguae (talk) 23:27, 23 September 2024 (UTC)

I see the TW menu, but not the "Warn" link. Susbush (talk) 01:20, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

What URL are you at when you're looking at the TW menu? Warn will only show up if you're on a user page or user talk page, and if that page isn't your own. –Novem Linguae (talk) 03:09, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

Oh, so that's why it wasn't showing up. Susbush (talk) 11:30, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

 Closing without action –Novem Linguae (talk) 12:12, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

XFDCloser issue?

There's some potential cross-script issues between this and WP:XFDC, if any of the technically-minded back-end programmers could check out this conversation at XFDC's talk page, we would much appreciate it. Primefac (talk) 12:03, 26 September 2024 (UTC)

Replied there. Bug is not caused by Twinkle. – SD0001 (talk) 18:14, 26 September 2024 (UTC)

 Closing without action –Novem Linguae (talk) 12:13, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

Warning about citing Wikipedia

Am I right in thinking that Twinkle does not have a warning template for people who cite Wikipedia? If so, could one be added? Does such a template already exist? I have been unable to find one. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:47, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

I've been using Template:Uw-circular. Hope this helps! DonIago (talk) 15:04, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

Thank you. That is for when a user "cited the information you added to another Wikipedia article or an external wiki." - a small subset of the cases I describe. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 17:23, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

You might have better luck at Wikipedia:Template index/User talk namespace; Twinkle doesn't host (or create) warning templates, it just provides an easier way to post them. Primefac (talk) 13:27, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

I may be being a bit thick here, but I guess I'm not seeing the distinction? Are you talking about citing Wikipedia outside the scope of Wikipedia itself? DonIago (talk) 15:17, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

No, the confusion is mine; I misread the template. Apologies. I have changed the wording slightly to make it clearer. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 17:57, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

 Closing without action –Novem Linguae (talk) 12:13, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

Request: Last protection duration in dialogue box?

Tracked in github.com
Issue #2021

Is it possible, when bringing up the dialogue box to protect a page, to show the duration of the last protection? Like how when you're blocking someone, it shows how long the last block was for. ... discospinster _talk 19:52, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

@Discospinster. When I went to test this, it shows this already. For example, go to WP:ANI, then do TW -> PP. Under Tagging options, I see the red text Current protection level: Move: sysop (indefinite) by ScottishFinnishRadish. Previous protections: protection log • pending changes log (expired 2019-02-24). Got any pages where this isn't showing up that you'd like me to look into? –Novem Linguae (talk) 12:17, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

I'm thinking of articles that are not currently edit protected but have been in the past - for how long was the immediately previous protection? For example Ni Hao, Kai Lan shows that it's currently move protected, but I'm interested in the length of the last edit protection (in this case it was one year but in the Twinkle dialogue box I have to click on "protection log" to see that). ... discospinster _talk 17:31, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

Requesting addition of new welcome template

Tracked in github.com
Issue #2020

Hey folks! I'd like to request the addition of Template:Welcome draft to Twinkle's welcome menu. There has been a lot of interest from AfC reviewers for a welcome message tailored toward new users who have already started building drafts. The welcome template was adapted from a custom message I've been using, with refinements provided by other reviewers at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Articles for creation#AfC-tailored Welcome template. The template supports a parameter for a linked article. Please let me know if there are any questions. Thanks! ~Liance^talk 16:23, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

Request: Inline parenthetical referencing

Tracked in github.com
Issue #2022

It would be nice if {{Inline parenthetical referencing}} were added. Snowman304|talk 01:14, 6 October 2024 (UTC)

@Snowman304. Are you aware of any other inline templates that Twinkle places? I don't think there are any. I don't think Twinkle has the ability to place anything inline, which would probably require the visual editor. –Novem Linguae (talk) 12:19, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

@Novem Linguae: Template:Inline parenthetical referencing is confusingly named. It's about parenthetical referencing that's inline, not an inline template for parenthetical referencing. It produces the same sort of box that, say, Template:Cleanup lang would. Snowman304|talk 00:10, 17 October 2024 (UTC)

Ah, got it. I've gone ahead and renamed the template to {{Parenthetical referencing}}, since "inline" and "section" both have very specific meaning in maintenance tag template names, and that is not what is going on here. –Novem Linguae (talk) 08:09, 17 October 2024 (UTC)

Missing line break when protecting AFD page

Tracked in github.com
Issue #1870

Reported by @Star Mississippi at User talk:Star Mississippi#Quack!.

There should be a line break at the end of line 1 in this diff.

Posting here to remind myself to investigate more before deciding to make a GitHub ticket. Maybe it's as simple as ticking a box or something. –Novem Linguae (talk) 15:44, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

CSD criteria for categories and another small issue

Tracked in github.com
Issue #1994
Resolved

The CSD criteria for categories should be changed to include the new criteria C4, instead of just showing C1 and two other general criteria. Would help a ton when doing technical CSDs for categories. (I know you can add your own stuff but it always doesn't work for me.) The criteria is also brand new so I don't blame you for not seeing it. I also had a bit of an issue when I was opening up a CFD using Twinkle, it had subst: it but it only pasted in the whole template and not the actual subst: here is the diff but was fixed by Pppery in the next edit. Cowboygilbert - (talk) ♥ 02:01, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

We have a ticket and a patch to add C4 already. Will see if I can expedite it.

Looks like the bad diff was caused by malformed wikicode syntax provided by the user. Changing [[[[ to [[ fixes the subst. Probably no need to fix this on the Twinkle side. –Novem Linguae (talk) 07:38, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

I approved the CSD C4 patch and did a deploy just now. Should be all set. –Novem Linguae (talk) 09:44, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Close paraphrasing note in warnings

There is only one level for this, which might be a bit strong for new editors Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously and persistent violators will be blocked from editing. Can we get a lighter level, similar to how there are multiple levels for vandalism? Bogazicili (talk) 14:57, 19 October 2024 (UTC)

This isn't really a Twinkle issue because it involves the creation of new user warning (Uw) templates. Wikipedia talk:Template index/User talk namespace might be a better place to suggest this. –Novem Linguae (talk) 19:41, 19 October 2024 (UTC)

 Closing without action –Novem Linguae (talk) 05:42, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

Noticeboard notifications are marked as minor edits

Tracked in github.com
Issue #2032

When a user is given a noticeboard notification through the Talkback feature (I don't know about the other three), it somehow gets marked as minor (diff). This causes the user to not receive the notification associated with the edit (I know, because ClueBot marks my talk page archivings as minor and I don't get new message alerts on them). Since the point of these notifications is to make sure they are aware of the discussion (especially since ANI requires the user to be notified), these should not be marked as minor. ミラP@Miraclepine 02:17, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

Users will get a notification alright even if the edit is marked as minor. ClueBot doesn't trigger notifications because its edits are additionally marked as bot edits. – SD0001 (talk) 05:29, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

No, minor edits on your user talk don't trigger alerts. Nardog (talk) 07:56, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

From testing it on testwiki, looks like you're right. Is this some recent change? I've always remembered it working that way, and it's what the code says as well – minor edits should suppress notifications only if the editor has nominornewtalk right, which per Special:ListGroupRights is only available to bots. – SD0001 (talk) 11:54, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

It's worked that way for as far back as I can remember. Here's me telling an editor to mark their c/e edits on my talk page as minor in February 2019. Nardog (talk) 05:16, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

Adding article functionality to Template:Welcome cookie

Hello,

Would it be possible to add article naming functionality to Template:Welcome Cookie in the same way as Template:Welcome? This way, the template would say something to the effect of "I noticed your edits on <x article> and wanted to welcome you! Etc. Let me know if this has already been discussed!

Thanks!

JuxtaposedJacob (talk) | :) | he/him | 09:34, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for the idea. This page is mainly for changing the Twinkle gadget. Requests for coders to edit/improve templates might be a better fit for WP:RT or WP:VPT. Hope that helps. –Novem Linguae (talk) 09:50, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you @Novem Linguae, will follow up there.

Have a great day!

JuxtaposedJacob (talk) | :) | he/him | 06:47, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

 Closing without action –Novem Linguae (talk) 20:40, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia Dark Mode

Tracked in github.com
Issue #1979

Could we add support for the new wikipedia dark mode? TheWikipede (talk) 13:16, 31 October 2024 (UTC)