Talk:Six (musical)

Norwegian Cruise Productions

I noticed that this has not been mentioned on the page yet, so I decided to bring it up here before adding anything. Six has been announced to be showing on Norwegian cruise ships Bliss (September 2019), Breakaway (November 2019), and Getaway (April 2020). The Bliss casting has been announced, however, I cannot find much on the Breakaway and Getaway productions just yet. Here is the Bliss cast:

• Catherine of Aragon - Candance Furbert.
• Anne Boleyn - Hazel Karooma-Brooker.
• Jane Seymour - Caitlin Tipping.
• Anna of Cleves - Sophie Golden.
• Katherine Howard - Alicia Corrales-Connor.
• Catherine Parr - Viquichelle Cross.
• Swing - Natalie Pilkington.
• Swing - Bryony Louise Duncan.
• Swing - Lori McLare.
• Swing - Amy Bridges.

A few links to back up the information:

• https://www.cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-news/21343-norwegian-cruise-line-to-add-six-the-musical.html
• https://www.seatrade-cruise.com/news/news-headlines/three-ncl-ships-to-stage-hit-musical-six/
• https://www.instagram.com/p/B08Cg6Dn1GB/ (I know Instagram isn't the most reliable but it's the only place I could find the casting info)

Redandsymmetry (talk) 19:26, 17 August 2019 (UTC)

Not notable to list cruise ship casts unless the performers themselves are of note. The full casting list should be limited to original casts for major theatre markets (West End/US Tour/Broadway). Mark E (talk) 10:53, 19 August 2019 (UTC)

Infobox Image

The official Playbill design for the Broadway production of Six has been revealed as of 16 January 2020 on Playbill's official website. Should the infobox image remain with the original West End poster or will it be updated to the Broadway Playbill?

References

Redandsymmetry (talk) 23:40, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

It is usually the original production images that are used if available. Changing it would be promotional to the Broadway production, especially when the image clearly represents the subject and Browadway was not where it originated.Blethering Scot 17:51, 5 March 2020 (UTC)

By that logic, I would argue that the image should be the poster from the Edinburgh Fringe run or the 2018 Off-West End run (the cast that recorded the studio album), depending on which you would count to be the "official" original production. Since the page counts the Edinburgh Fringe run as the show's official premiere, I'd say that would be the way to go. However, I am not entirely knowledgable on what does and doesn't count here, so if I come off like I think I know everything, that is not my intention and I am just curious about how things like that work around here. Thank you for your response. Redandsymmetry (talk) 03:19, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Broadway

The cast did perform multiple shows on Broadway before the hiatus, but something else has now changed, it has been nominated for Drama League awards. I think, we should now list the cast -- if the cast changes, we can make notes about that later. Alanscottwalker (talk) 19:07, 10 May 2020 (UTC)

I agree; it's an odd omission that the article talks about the Broadway previews but doesn't identify the cast.--Trystan (talk) 19:20, 10 May 2020 (UTC)

Its Broadway grosses were also of note. [1] [2] Alanscottwalker (talk) 19:40, 10 May 2020 (UTC)

The cast can be listed in the production section. BOVINEBOY2008 18:39, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

Not a good idea, because then we have a list of names and then the list of names again. -- Alanscottwalker (talk) 18:42, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

It is standard to list the names of the primary cast of the production in the production section. I'm not sure what you mean? BOVINEBOY2008 18:53, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

It's standard to list them in the cast list under Cast, that's where people will look for cast. None of the sections also list the same cast as there is in the Cast list section because that would be badly repetitious and bad article writing. Alanscottwalker (talk) 19:14, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

I agree, so why are we listing them in the cast table? Other theatre articles do not list preview casts. Why would this cast be different? BOVINEBOY2008 19:52, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

The cast that has played Broadway and gotten Broadway grosses and Broadway award nominations is already listed in the cast table because it is the same cast as the 2019 cast. There is no reason, at all, to list that cast again in the production section. Obviously, the world is a bit different and we have more than enough ability to deal with the world at it is now, not as it was or how we wish it would be, without producing two identical cast lists. Alanscottwalker (talk) 20:29, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

The cast table only needs to contain the West End original cast (with any notable (blue-linked) replacements noted under the table, and the Broadway/US tour cast, which should be in ONE column, not two. It is very likely that if this show does start up again after Broadway reopens (who know when that will be -- maybe not until next year), the cast will have numerous changes. The other casts (or at least the notable members of them) should be mentioned in the Productions section. By the way, I do not think sound designers and music directors of musicals should be mentioned at all in Wikipedia articles (including productions sections), unless they are blue-linked people or, say, win a Tony or Olivier for their work. -- Ssilvers (talk) 21:13, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

Agreed. This cast may be the opening cast on Broadway, but it may not. If it isn't then some of these names will be footnotes in the history of the article. This is not a fansite, we do not need to list every cast that ever existed. BOVINEBOY2008 12:26, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

The only cast currently listed that I would support removing is the original Australian cast. The Edinburgh cast is notable as originators of the roles. The Off-West End cast is notable as the studio album cast. West End and Broadway casts are clearly notable, and it is helpful to the reader (and doesn't take much space) to note in the chart that these same casts both initially completed a national tour. While the Broadway cast is a Broadway Preview cast at this point in time, the circumstances are extraordinary. If the pandemic shutdown results in a change to the original Broadway cast in a show that was hours away from opening, that will be worth showing. So that's one potential future edition, for a Broadway cast if changed. The table is not too large as it is. For those casts that are listed in the article, they should be in the cast table. If a cast isn't notable enough for the table, I think we would leave it out of the article entirely, rather than awkwardly shuffling it to the productions section.--Trystan (talk) 13:30, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

Nothing fan-site about it. It's about actual history. The North American/Broadway cast is the subject of extensive commentary in the article (including from internationally influential critic Chris Jones, as well as the New York Times theater critic) and awards in the article. And the COVID19 pandemic break (the opening night being on the exact night of the hiatus) will always be in the history of this show. The arbitrariness of the proposed exclusion, if they played only one more show makes no sense for the encyclopedia. Also, the cast that has played Broadway is in only one-column list, with a bifurcated title, noting the actual history. What the encyclopedia is not is predictors of the future. The future will take care of itself, with sourced edits when it happens. (No objection from me, about moving of the Australia cast, but Trystan is right about the other casts, see also Hamilton (musical)). Alanscottwalker (talk) 14:15, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

There is very much a fansite element to listing every cast in a table, where we should be featuring historically notable casts. In fact, it is chocked up to WP:FANCRUFT. It doesn't go to show that every show that has entered previews is mentioned by these critics, let alone occasionally featured. Which certainly gives merit to discuss the cast in the article. But it is giving undue weight to a cast that has essentially only had glorified rehearsals. They now have TWO columns in the table. This gives a casual reader that perhaps they are twice as important, or played twice as many shows as the others. I do think it is appropriate to have a column for the tour, and perhaps we can add a note that this cast entered Broadway previews before the shut down. I think this would be a more appropriate representation. BOVINEBOY2008 16:41, 14 May 2020 (UTC)

It is false that there anything fancruft about it. It is also false that there are two columns, the names are listed once in a single list, with a bifucated heading. The bifucated heading indicates the historical progress of the production, the historical progress of the production is written about in prose in the article. There is nothing more to write about the production, now so your claim of undue weight has no merit, this is all there is -- the end -- in the current encyclopedic view, for now. --Alanscottwalker (talk) 17:17, 14 May 2020 (UTC)

Your tone of ownership of how this table appears is not conducive to finding consensus on this matter. I have edited the table that gives the proper weight to this cast with the mention of Broadway. This contains the same information that you want to portray without using and extra column. (Yes, it is an extra column, that's why each actors cell indicates in the coding "colspan=2".) If you do not think this is amenable, I'm happy to discuss other ways we can accommodate this. BOVINEBOY2008 17:39, 15 May 2020 (UTC)

No, stop making misrepresentations. Nothing I have said indicates ownership. You have pointed to no sources and no guidelines for your POV-pushing. You rely solely on your unsourced peculiar POV about "glorified rehearsals", when the performances in fact, according to sources made millions of dollars, included award nominated performances, and had reviews by notable professionals. Unlike you, my comments have been adhering to reliably sourced information. I am gratified, at the least, that there is now movement that the cast-table does have to reflect the actual sourced history. Alanscottwalker (talk) 18:07, 15 May 2020 (UTC)

I don’t much care whether the UK Tour/West End and NA Tour/Broadway Preview casts use a colspan or not, but the table should at least use a consistent approach between the two.--Trystan (talk) 18:34, 15 May 2020 (UTC)

This quote "this is all there is -- the end -- in the current encyclopedic view, for now." indicates an ownership for how information is presented in this article. This tone is not helpful, it does not move anyone in the direction of consensus. It merely highlights how immovable your POV is. I don't appreciate the accusation that I am trying to push a POV. I have offered different ways to present the information and how I think it violates the guidelines we have set out in this article.

Let me clarify what I meant: in typical circumstances, a preview performance cast does not need to be mentioned. I fully recognize that this is not typical. I do think the cast should be mentioned, my concern was how the information was being presented. I apologize if I was not able to communicate this clearly. BOVINEBOY2008 18:42, 15 May 2020 (UTC)

I think you misunderstood, 'this is all there is - the end' is a statement of fact about the sourced information available, and in which we have to make our decisions about what is due. There is no more sourced information to go on -- the production has stopped -- there is nothing more sourced to say about it, and we don't make guesses about the future (ie., guesses about the future have no weight). Alanscottwalker (talk) 20:49, 15 May 2020 (UTC)

Second UK Tour

Since this is a significant tour, with a total of more than 30 stops in the UK, I believe this second UK Tour cast should be added to the page, as it is of significance. Account2468 (talk) 23:51, 8 July 2020 (UTC)

Oppose. The section is for originating casts and West End and Broadway and every second tour will be argued to be significant, and third tour and fourth tour . . . -- Alanscottwalker (talk) 23:08, 8 July 2020 (UTC)

Musical numbers

I have a small problem with some of the new tracks from the Broadway cast recording being included under the musical numbers section: they are not musical numbers. "But there's only one you need to hear from tonight...", "Now, seeing as Henry was running out of women to marry in England...", and "So, I guess you alright know what happened next..." are all recorded sections of dialogue used as introductory monologues for the respective songs that they precede. Their titles are the first part of that dialogue (I do wish they had used something more concise for the titles, but that's not a matter that's relevant here). However, I do not know whether the right thing would be to just remove them, or make a change to the title of the section, so I decided I would bring it up here. Redandsymmetry (talk) 02:53, 11 May 2022 (UTC)

You're completely right. I've changed it back to what it was prior. Mark E (talk) 08:06, 11 May 2022 (UTC)

Six

What is six sbout 80.2.187.177 (talk) 07:32, 16 July 2022 (UTC)

The musical, Six, is about the six wives of King Henry VIII. It's a shorter musical, but gives a specific song and voice to each of the six women and allows them to tell their own story, whether that is how their relationship with Henry was or their legacy. In the style of a rock concert, the original message appears to be a competition over who had the hardest time as a wife of King Henry VIII but by the end, the true message comes to light: instead of fighting each other, the real villain is Henry and each wife had a valid experience, there is no reason to put the others down to "win." Society tries to put women in competition with each other instead of working together or supporting one another. The wives explore feminist themes of women supporting women, the "hierarchy of oppression" and history's tendency to associate women with a man instead of as their own person. It is an excellent musical that will have you ready to fight the patriarchy afterwards. RileyLara (talk) 20:38, 18 November 2023 (UTC)

It's too stupid to describe. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.71.91.188 (talk) 13:34, 29 September 2023 (UTC)

Swings and Alternates

Due to how the show treats its alts and swings, (two scheduled shows a week, custom costumes) would it be fitting to write a section on them? 2600:1700:CB20:4918:5D8D:9D7C:3930:252B (talk) 01:15, 20 November 2022 (UTC)

It is sort of unique to the show, I would say that it is significant in some regard. The article isn't too big, so I don't see much harm in adding a section on it. Shamokinite (talk) 15:32, 26 April 2023 (UTC)

Casts

I removed the inclusion of the cruise casts, alternate casts and current casts. The lists get unmanageable if we include absolutely every cast for the show ever. There is strong precedent to just include the original casts for major productions in tables, and I see absolutely no reason to deviate from the norm here. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 23:08, 24 February 2023 (UTC)

That makes sense. I think I just got too carried away with adding stuff hehe. In the future we can add only major venues then? --Octopusplushie (talk) 01:16, 25 February 2023 (UTC)

OK looks like someone added them back. I'll revert it once, but I won't make further change as I don't want to be in an edit war. In the meantime maybe we can make a semi-protected request. --Octopusplushie (talk) 21:17, 27 February 2023 (UTC)