Talk:Hemp/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Vandalism

Someone seems to have embedded "==SMOKE WEED==" at the top of the page in the HTML source code. I don't know how to take it out, as it's not in the edit box, but I suggest someone with access to the source do so. 159.28.100.219 (talk) 19:18, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

That was removed awhile ago, a few minutes after it was added. Maybe you need to bypass your browser's cache? Deli nk (talk) 19:22, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

THE ARTICLE BY MERE TITLE IS WRONG. HEMP SEED OIL IS WHAT THIS IS ABOUT AND YOU ARE CALLING IT HEMP OIL. NOT THE SAME THING AT ALL.

http://www.phoenixtearsmovie.com —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.215.89.65 (talk) 07:35, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Neutrality

I was looking for why Hemp isn't used more often in products. I think this article doesn't point out any of the problems involving hemp production. I am not knowledgeable in this area but I would assume there are reasons other then the bad stigma from the drug. For example is it more expensive to produce? Less comfortable then cotton, requires more land then usual... You get the point. There needs to be a section for the downside of hemp use.68.36.50.233 (talk) 19:40, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

It's one of the less successful coarse fibers. Cotton is better for clothing, manila is better for rope, jute is better for bags, kenaf is better for papermaking, and bagasse is cheaper because it's a byproduct of sugar cane. As I note occasionally, it's amusing to observe how little interest the hemp enthusiasts have in the other coarse fibers. There's quite a bit of development going on in the coarse fibre area, such as cellulostic ethanol R&D, kenaf paper technology, and particleboard from bagasse. But somehow this just doesn't interest the hemp fans. --John Nagle (talk) 02:28, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Please elaborate, 'better' isn't particularly specific. Vekkul (talk) 13:58, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

These 'better' comparisons are oversimplifications. Each material lends different qualities, and depending what qualities one is looking for, one or the other may be better. Also, not all sources of a given material are equal which complicates making comparisons (plant variety, growing conditions, and processing can make a big difference). For example, both hemp rope and manilla rope vary significantly in quality depending on their source, but at their best, hemp is stronger than manilla. Manilla is more water resistant, however hemp more flexible. (see Rope) So which is 'better'? Well, it depends the quality of the sources you have available, and what your needs are. Your point is good that these other fibers deserve more recognition and consideration. However dismissing hemp simplistically as inferior in all ways, isn't any more helpful than the ignoring of other fibers by hemp-proponents. --Ericjs (talk) 16:11, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Toning down some of the hype

There are claims here that don't stand scrutiny. The lede section indicates that hemp is a major industrial product. It's not. Hemp paper is somewhere around 0.05% of paper production. Hemp as a building material has been tried in a few prototypes. Hemp-based plywood seems to have been discontinued. Hemcrete [1] is real and occasionally used, but the only site selling it hasn't been updated in three years. On the nutritional front, some of the nutritional claims ("Hemp seeds contain all the essential amino acids and essential fatty acids necessary to maintain healthy human life") are also true of flax, which isn't usually considered a food. Also, the source for that [2] looks like WP:FRINGE, with sections like "Hempseed Oils and the Flow of Life Force". --John Nagle (talk) 06:57, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

Removed "Mercedes-Benz uses a "biocomposite" composed principally of hemp fiber for the manufacture of interior panels in some of its automobiles." It's unsourced, and all the sources I can find seem to be hemp promotion sites. A book on biocomposites says Mercedes-Benz is using jute, not hemp.[3] --John Nagle (talk) 19:55, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

Removed "Hemp Plastic" promotional link. Their only product is an overpriced CD jewel box ($2 each). Not notable. --John Nagle (talk) 20:02, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

Put all the fiber-related topics under subheads of "Fiber". Found a solid cite from a composites journal on hemp usage in cars; the material turns out to be a fiberglass composite with hemp, kenaf, or flax used as a filler, and it's being used in real cars in quantity. The manufacturer just uses whatever bast fiber is cheap and available. --John Nagle (talk) 17:37, 3 July 2009 (UTC)

Back on the nutritional front; both hempseed and its meal after oil pressing are far superior to linseed (flax) and other industrial oil seeds, as hempseed lacks the anti-nutritional factors that are present in these other grains, for example. The oil profile of hempseed oil is also far superior to the other industrial food oils. No hype, check the facts!Jace1 (talk) 11:42, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

Contradiction with Essential amino acid

Its amino acid profile is close to "complete" when compared to more common sources of proteins such as meat, milk, eggs and soy.

This contradicts Essential amino acid, which says that eggs are the reference for completeness. Vagary (talk) 22:21, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

Conspiracy?

I'm sure you just love conspiracy stories, but there is a pretty significant one being spread among pot-smokers out there, that DuPont holds back help production in the USA by making marijuana illegal to increase its profits...somehow. I cant believe no one has mentioned this yet, it seems like such an obvious point of interest since hemp production is still banned in only the USA. I would like to see a section that mentions this. Maybe someone can find out about this and confirm or debunk it finally and for good, or at least explain the history and reasoning behind the USA ban on hemp. It seems to be mentioned that the USA gov't does not differentiate the hemp subspecies from the drug one, but every other major nation does?? 99.177.105.69 (talk) 16:35, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

A common story bandied about by hemp proponents was that there was once a healthy hemp industry in the U.S. but sometime around the early 20th century (or maybe it was 19th century...I'm unsure) the hemp industry was purposely undermined by either the cotton industry, or the wood pulp industry (I've heard both versions), who fanned the flames of anti-marijuana hysteria and lobbied for anti-marijuana legislation that would made hemp illegal as well. I have no idea what the truth is behind these stories but they are common enough that a) they are worth mentioning as common folklore, and b) evidence for or against these stories cited if anyone can come up with anything. (I actually came to this article because I was curious about this!) --Ericjs (talk) 15:43, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

--Ericjs (talk) 15:43, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Removed bogus info from hemp sites

There are a few bogus items which keep creeping back into the article. The usual items are 1) the Declaration of Independence was written on hemp paper, 2) US currency used to be printed on hemp paper, 3) Levi's jeans were made from hemp, and 4) William Randolph Hearst was behind marijuana prohibition. None of those have reliable sources; most derive from books by Jack Herer.[4]. We actually have solid sources showing that 2) and 3) are false. --John Nagle (talk) 06:44, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Absolute time references, please.

The sentence "In the past three years, commercial success of hemp food products has grown considerably." will clearly become stale as time passes. Better would be "From 2006 to 2009, commercial success of hemp food products grew considerably." (supposing this to be the correct time frame). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.168.70.185 (talk) 18:07, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

Bogus material about AMA testimony in 1937.

The actual testimony of the AMA's lobbyist is available.[5]. The material inserted by an anon grossly misrepresents the AMA's position, which was:

"Mr. Dingell (Congressman): Going back to that part of your testimony wherein you mentioned the matter of registration, was it your testimony that the medical profession, so far as you can determine, is more than willing to cooperate in bringing about the suppression of this drug, or, more specifically, the traffic in marihuana; and does your sole objection rest upon the point that the bill requires an additional registration, additional forms, and the taking up of additional precious time of physicians ; and that further than that, if this practice could be regulated by an amendment to the harrison narcotics Act there would be no objection on the part of the medical profession to filling out new amended forms pertaining to both marihuana and narcotics?"

"Dr. Woodward (AMA) : I believe that if that had been done there would not have been a single objection raised to it.In my opinion, no voice would have been raised against legislation of that kind."

The AMA lobbyist was objecting to a regulatory scheme which required different registration and paperwork paperwork from that required for narcotic drugs.

Accordingly, I undid this change.[6].--John Nagle (talk) 07:43, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

Hemp for parachutes?

Seem to remember Hemp was used as parachute material in WWII.

It was in Jack Here's book

Deleted info

The edits on 4 October 2005 by user 68.67.234.169 deleted some information. I'm unsure whether the deletions were all appropriate, so if anyone wants to add them back then take a look.

Hemp as Reinforcement for composites

Hemp is increasingly being used as a reinforcment to polymer based composites. I disagree with the article that the increasing oil price will lead to its increase in use. The composites matrix is produced from oil not the reinforcment.The hemps main rival is glass fibre.hemp will allow a cheaper fibre a lighter fibre, and a fibre that produces no carbon emissions.

Yields of growing hemp

Perhaps it is possible to include a rough indication about the amount of money that can be earned with growing hemp; it is around 25000€ per harvest for a standard amount of plants cultivated in a building. Per year, 4 harvests are possible. The reason I think this information should be included and distributed free is because aldough on the news there is much talk about it and that it is "lucrative", you never get to hear about how much it really goes. As I believe all information should be free, this kind of cover ups annoy me and therefore I think it should be included.

Rudolph Diesel story misplaced?

Seems like the paragraphs about Rudolph Diesel do not really belong inside a Hemp entry.

If the story on hemp (or canibus sativa, wherever it will reside) deals with fuel, which is appropriate, because filtered hemp oil is a fuel, particularly for diesels, which were invented by Rudolph Diesel, who used hemp oil as fuel. Seems to belong.

Before motors there were oil-lamp dudes, think! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Fifi J (talk • contribs) 06:35, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Hemp vs marijuana

Could someone please explain to me the difference between hemp and marijuana? I seem to recall hearing one time that hemp is from the male form of the plant and does not contain THC and is used for hemp fibers, and that marijuana is the female form and does contain THC and is used as a drug. Is this at all correct? Axeman (talk) 00:11, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

It's in the boilerplate description. Cannabis sativa L. subsp. sativa var. sativa is Hemp, C. sativa subsp. indica is marijuana. The major difference between the two plants is the amount of THC in them, Hemp contains below 0.3% and Marijuana anywhere from 6 to over 20%. Atheuz (talk) 00:47, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Both used to be called just hemp. The word marijuana was just a slang term for hemp in Mexico. It came into use when efforts were being made to ban it in the US. Legislators who never would have voted to ban such a useful plant voted to ban the scary sounding marijuana from south of the border. - Lisa (talk - contribs) 15:14, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

link hemp oil with the conspiracy key word search.

The idea is that the original perpetrator of the hemp oil conspiracy was John Rockefeller who offered Henry Ford 1 million dollars in exchange for him to redesign the engine on the model T from running on hemp oil to running on petroleum based gasoline. Is this true? Yes. Is hemp, which produces a nonpsycoactive source of THC (a hydrocabon) still illegal to be cultivated in the U.S.? yes. Are we ready to change that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.76.27.25 (talk) 09:51, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

I'm confused about the wording in the first paragraph. Shouldn't it say "imported to the United States" instead of "exported to the United States"? Or am I misinterpreting that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.71.112.114 (talk) 22:19, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

William Randolph Heart was the original architect of the prohibition of hemp as marijuana, when nobody knew they were the same plant. Hearst was the largest buyer of newsprint as well as the largest owner of timber. Do you think that he wanted to pay farmers for fiber? He got together with his friends, the DuPonts, that had patents on the chemical processes necessary to make paper from trees, and their banker, Andrew Mellon, whom was also Secretary of the Treasury at the time. Mellon used his position to appoint his nephew, Henry Anslinger to the head of the organization which later became the DEA. Ansliger would travel around the country telling people about how marijuana would make nice white girls become sex slaves for black jazz musicians. Ansligner even claimed that marijuana would make Mexicans homicidal and kill people, just like night of the living dead, because the troops of Pancho Villa at the Alamo were all smoking marijuana. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.23.138.200 (talk) 23:08, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

Hempcrete, again.

More bogus info on Hempcrete crept in again. Here's the manufacturer's data sheet: [7] It's not a structural material. It's used as exterior insulation, supported by a brick or wood frame. It competes with stucco, not poured concrete. A "7 times stronger than concrete" line showed up on some hemp sites and was widely copied, but the material is in fact much weaker than concrete. [8]. See also Straw-bale construction and Exterior Insulation Finishing System for alternatives. Hempcrete is claimed to be waterproof, which is an advantage. But it's also claimed to be biodegradeable. It's hard for a material to be both. --John Nagle (talk) 17:54, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

Only that company makes that claim. Anyone can make a product several times stronger than portland cement that is a fraction of the weight out of just hemp, limestone, and water. It is because the hurd fibers of hemp are so strong. I have many samples of hemp products, including the concrete, that are far superior to any construction material made from petroleum products. I have a drywall sample made from 100% hemp and bonded only with hydrogen. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.23.138.200 (talk) 19:49, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

We look forward to a published test report from an ASTM certified concrete testing[9] lab. --John Nagle (talk) 21:08, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

Why would the ASTM do that? They are owned by organizations that would not want hemp used. John Nagle works with DARPA, what a surprise. We look forward to the day when the American Military and Intelligence Services work to help Americans instead of subjugating Americans for the financial profit of the few. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.23.138.200 (talk) 23:02, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

We aren't allowed to speculate on motivations any more than we are allowed to use personal opinions/experiences/etc for anything else here. Sometimes the WP:TRUTH just isn't allowed. Crazy, no? But that shouldn't be surprising for a mainstream encyclopedia that requires reliable sources and verification rather than giving much weight to WP:FRINGE ideas or claims by some random person on the internet. Maybe some day this whole conspiracy will be revealed and the facts you know will come to light--then we welcome them into this encyclopedia. DMacks (talk) 23:07, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

All of the citations from members of the North American Industrial Hemp Council are also weightless claims by random people on the internet. If you had real citations instead of deceptive pseudoscience put out by people like David West, I wouldn't need to object to the truth. The truth is that the United States Government is correct, in saying that hemp and marijuana are the same plant. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.23.138.200 (talk) 23:13, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

Allergy issues

Someone recently put in an unsubstantiated claim that there are no known allergies to hemp. Contact and pollen allergies have been reported. Flax seed (a close relative to hemp seed) allergy is known, but very rare. I put a "cite needed" on that claim. --John Nagle (talk) 08:38, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

Hemp/marijuana

These are the same plant. It was always known as hemp before Hearst spread his black propaganda against the plant in the 1920s. 'Marijuana' is simply the Spanish name for the English name 'hemp'. Hearst popularised the name marijuana to associate the plant with the Mexicans and because he want to discredit the plant with it is superior paper-making qualities because he owned the mills making paper out of wood. SmokeyTheCat 12:18, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

The "..superior paper-making qualities.." ??? Several countries in the EU never prohibited hemp in the 1930's but success for hemp has anyhow been very modest, there is no large scale production of news print from hemp. See for eg. [10]

We've been through this before, several times. Bank notes were not made from hemp paper. Levi's jeans were not made from hemp. The Declaration of Independence was not written on hemp paper. There was no "Hearst Paper Manufacturing Division of Kimberly Clark". (Kimberly-Clark did at one time make newsprint exclusively for the New York Times, not a Hearst paper.) There are cites for all those items earlier on this talk page. Most of those bogus claims come from Jack Herer's books. They're widely copied on pro-hemp sites, and they keep creeping into Wikipedia. But they're bogus. --John Nagle (talk) 16:05, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

Also, tea bags are not made from hemp. Muslin, nylon, and abacá are used. Abacá is sometimes called "manila hemp", but it's not related to hemp; it's a species of banana. --John Nagle (talk) 21:13, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

Well Nagle your algarithm is now disabled often, and your pages and articles aren't noteworthy, so how then can you say that anything is bogus, or not valid, your intelligent however your off base, as well as being misconstrued, whether or not the claims Jack made are true, the fact remains that hemp CAN save the planet, and that the US Gov is trying to not let hemp in — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.169.33.29 (talk) 00:58, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

(Header inserted to show archiver where to start)

FIRSTLY- hemp hasnt been used in MODERN times as introduction suggests, hemp has been used for THOUSANDS of years. E.G. Every piece of paper in nepal before 1950 was made of hemp. - THALEX CORPORATION —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.104.241.208 (talk) 20:51, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

ACTUALLY- hemp HAS and IS being used in these MODERN times, as the introduction suggests! For example, the next time you see someone smoking a tobacco cigarette, notice the paper (hemp), or the next time you see some one making tea with a tea bag (again, notice the paper used to make the bag), and many countries still use hemp fiber in their paper money, for example. The EU still pays a subsidy for hemp production, throughout the EU. Yes, hemp has also been used for at least "...THOUSANDS of years".Jace1 (talk) 11:12, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

Hemp/marijuana

These are the same plant. It was always known as hemp before Hearst spread his black propaganda against the plant in the 1920s. 'Marijuana' is simply the Spanish name for the English name 'hemp'. Hearst popularised the name marijuana to associate the plant with the Mexicans and because he want to discredit the plant with it is superior paper-making qualities because he owned the mills making paper out of wood. SmokeyTheCat 12:18, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

The "..superior paper-making qualities.." ??? Several countries in the EU never prohibited hemp in the 1930's but success for hemp has anyhow been very modest, there is no large scale production of news print from hemp. See for eg. [11]

We've been through this before, several times. Bank notes were not made from hemp paper. Levi's jeans were not made from hemp. The Declaration of Independence was not written on hemp paper. There was no "Hearst Paper Manufacturing Division of Kimberly Clark". (Kimberly-Clark did at one time make newsprint exclusively for the New York Times, not a Hearst paper.) There are cites for all those items earlier on this talk page. Most of those bogus claims come from Jack Herer's books. They're widely copied on pro-hemp sites, and they keep creeping into Wikipedia. But they're bogus. --John Nagle (talk) 16:05, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

Also, tea bags are not made from hemp. Muslin, nylon, and abacá are used. Abacá is sometimes called "manila hemp", but it's not related to hemp; it's a species of banana. --John Nagle (talk) 21:13, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

Well Nagle your algarithm is now disabled often, and your pages and articles aren't noteworthy, so how then can you say that anything is bogus, or not valid, your intelligent however your off base, as well as being misconstrued, whether or not the claims Jack made are true, the fact remains that hemp CAN save the planet, and that the US Gov is trying to not let hemp in — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.169.33.29 (talk) 00:58, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

genus question

According to other information I've read, this statement seems incorrect--or, perhaps could use better clarification?

"Cannabis sativa L. subsp. sativa var. sativa is the variety grown for industrial use, while C. sativa subsp. indica generally has poor fiber quality and is primarily used for production of recreational and medicinal drugs. " — Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.173.11.2 (talk) 21:22, 17 August 2011 (UTC)

Large block of text

The following was posted by a user but lacks encyclopedic integrity and any number of other wikipedia standards, it is preserved here but it should be noted that THIS IS NOT MY WORK:

--72.83.128.51 (talk) 05:05, 27 August 2011 (UTC)

"The March 21st "New York Times" announced that the North American Industrial Hemp Council, "a coalition of farmers, politicians, manufacturers and environmental groups." is filing two petitions. One, to ask the U.S. Department of Agriculture to create a licensing system permitting farmers to once again grow hemp in this country, and another to ask the DEA (Drug Enforcement Administration) to end its classification of industrial hemp as an illegal drug. In the past, though the DEA has the power to issue such permits, it has refused, citing its concern that industrial hemp might be diverted as an illegal drug. Though experts have long pointed out that industrial hemp contains too low a level of the psychedelic component, THC (tetrahydro cannabinol) to interest the underground drug market, the DEA has not changed its mind. According to the "Time's" article, Raymond Bernard, speaking for America's carpet manufacturers emphasized hemp's "durability," the on-going expense of importing it, plus the fact that, unlike the present-day synthetic carpets such as nylon, hemp is completely bio-degradable. The Hemp Council also argued that in contrast to cotton which is "the most environmentally damaging of all crops because of its intensive need for pesticides," hemp cultivation requires no pesticides and little water. Cotton is a water-intensive crop. As was pointed out in the 1995 documentary "The Hemp Revolution," hemp has no natural enemies "except the U.S. government." The history of hemp, or marijuana as it is commonly known in this country, goes back thousands of years. In a Chinese pharmacy book as early as 2737 BC, hemp was recommended for rheumatism, ulcers, earaches, menstrual cramps and malaria. The Egyptian Pharaoh Ramses II recommended it as an eyewash. Hemp was the first plant known to be cultivated by man, and both its healing and mind-altering properties were understood across the ancient world. Hemp fibers were used in the first woven fabric. Carbon dating places some such weavings as far back as 8,000 BC. Hemp was used for paper long before linen or papyrus, whereas wood pulp as the mainstay for paper manufacture became popular only after the 1920s. Early settlers in America were encouraged, even instructed by colonial governments, to plant hemp. Both George Washington and Thomas Jefferson grew hemp on their plantations and Benjamin Franklin started one of America's firs paper mills, using cannabis (hemp) as the basis. both America's Bill of Rights and our Declaration of Independence were written on hemp paper. In fact, until some time around the 1920s, all official documents were ordered to be written on hemp paper because of its durability. During the days of sailing ships, the canvas for their sails, ropes and rigging were of hemp, and early Americans traveled west in wagons covered with hemp canvas. "Canvas" is the Dutch word for "cannabis." Levi Strauss made his first trousers for the Gold Rush pioneers from hemp canvas. The 1850, the U.S. census counted 8,327 hemp plantations (minimum 2,000 acres), but did not include the millions of hemp patches on family farms. The mood-altering qualities of hemp (marijuana or hashish) have been understood and used both socially and in religious rites since man's pre-dawn history. The story of hemp's early popularity in this country, its disappearance after being criminalized as "marijuana," its resurgence as a vital commercial crop during WW II and its second demise after the defeat of Germany and Japan is a fascinating chronicle of commercial greed, the almost criminal compliance of the press, and the unbelievable power of isolationist attitude and lack of curiosity about other culture that makes it easy for our commercially-directed press and media to manipulate the American populace. Ignorance of foreign cultures restricts our understanding of those mood-altering drugs which people around the world accept as part of their lifestyle. Hemp's demise and plant's criminalization is a story understood today by few Americans. For those interested in the details, I recommend either of two books: "The Great Book of Hemp" by Rowan Robinson (Park Street Press) or "The Emperor Wears No Clothes" by Jack Herer (Hemp Publishing, Van Nuys, CA). In brief, the campaign to destroy hemp as a commercial crop began in the early 1930s when DuPont chemists developed their first petrochemical fiber, nylon, and patented the sulfate and sulfite processes for making paper from wood pulp. About that time William Randolph Hearst, newspaper giant, was investing widely in lumber holdings as pulp for newsprint. Since hemp was cheaper and better source for paper than wood pulp, and hemp's superior fiber length, strength and low cost competed with nylon, the two commercial giants connived to destroy the hemp industry. (Cotton with a fiber length of 1 1/2 inches compared to hemp's 15 feet plus cotton's extensive water and pesticide requirements offered no threat to DuPont.) About this time other industrial chemists were developing plastics from such biomass products as hemp. Henry Ford, at his secret biomass conversion plant, had already built a model automobile of plastics derived largely from hemp with only the frame of metal. The car's fuel was also derived from hemp. To destroy commercial hemp it was necessary first to criminalize it, and so the campaign began. First, the name hemp was changed to "marijuana." DuPont then began lobbying the chief counsel of the Treasury Department, Herman Oliphant, to prohibit cannabis (hemp) cultivation, saying DuPont's synthetics could replace hemp oil commercially. Simultaneously, Hearst's papers began a campaign which portrayed Mexicans as "lazy, degenerate, and violent," and as marijuana smokers and job stealers. (Mexico's hero Pancho Villa, not incidentally, had stolen 800,000 acres of Hearst's prime timberland.) Meanwhile, the Federal Bureau of Narcotics had been established in 1930, and its first commissioner, Harry J. Anslinger, who at first ignored cannabis, was soon to become its most violent suppressor. When the Uniform Drug Act, which criminalized cannabis was passed by the National Council of Commissioners in 1932, and referred to the states for ratification, Harry Anslinger immediately assigned his 300 FBI agents to lobby state legislatures to pass the Act. Anslinger, as Jack Herer points out in his book, was nephew-in-law to Treasury Secretary and banker Andrew Mellon, who was not only busy financing DuPont but had actually designed Anslinger's government position. Anslinger's campaign against marijuana drew national interest and his distorted and often fabricated horror stories of marijuana use were widely printed. In time, this multi-faceted campaign against marijuana gained a significant following. On August 2nd, 1937, the Senate finally passed and President Franklin D. Roosevelt signed the Marijuana Act. As author Rowen Robinson notes, "Hemp, the environment and the American farmer had lost. The corporate giants had won. But the crusade against hemp had only begun." Today, with more than a million young men imprisoned for marijuana use and drug-related crimes, and while our prison-building and prison-maintenance industries grow exponentially, the private lives of Americans are increasingly threatened by the intrusions of local, state and federal drug squads. The proponents of continued criminalization of marijuana as expected are those who most stand to benefit from this on-going campaign: the DEA and their increasing state and local battalions; the entire petrochemical industry who fear the competition which today's biomass derivatives offer their products; those who build, maintain and staff prisons; the lobby of American businesses which enjoy cheap prison labor; the military who are elbowing their way into the anti-drug scene; and finally, our INS and their supporting court system. American's fight for that personal right to control their state of conscious awareness will be a tough one. No one has ever died from marijuana use, though millions have succumbed to both alcohol and cigarettes. Marijuana is not addicting, and with over 70,000,000 Americans admitting to have tried "reefers," that use has been either controlled or shrugged off by the majority. The oft-repeated story that marijuana use leads to hard drug use has never been substantiated. Both Holland, Switzerland accept marijuana use, and recently groups in Britain have rallied to decriminalize it. As for marijuana's therapeutic value, oncologists recommend it for the nausea associated with chemotherapy, ophthalmologists say it lowers intraocular pressures in their glaucoma patients, pulmonologists note its use in asthmatics. Marijuana relieves the pain of arthritis and as early as 1843 Jacques-Joseph Morceau extolled its anti-depressive qualities. Cannabis use in insomnia, alcoholism, drug withdrawal and migraine has been reported worldwide. Perhaps the time has come for Americans to re-introduce commercial hemp in this country as a first step in re-examining our attitudes toward a much-maligned but potentially valuable natural resource. All 11 countries of the European Union presently permit the growing of commercial hemp, a plant whose available protein content rivals that of the soy bean, and whose oil is nutritionally better. Just how the on-going legal battle between California's state initiative permitting marijuana's limited medical use and the powerful Federal Drug Administration will resolve is anyone's guess."

The above repeats many Jack Herer myths. Those have been debunked previously; see the talk archives of this page. --John Nagle (talk) 17:27, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

It would be important to explain how organized crime would take a role in the legalization of industrial hemp. I am referring to mafia activity in compassion to small time dealers. How this would effect the amount of profit gained and overall safety of citizens. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Campbemp (talk • contribs) 16:05, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

It would also be important to note how rates of teen pregnancy, swine flu, and plane crashes would grow exponentially due to the legalization of industrial hemp. I am referring to the direct correlation. 98.245.115.92 (talk) 05:03, 28 September 2011 (UTC) Maggie Sanders

Map

The map seems to show that the whole of Australia is suitable for growing cannabis, including the Nullabor plain and the great stony desert. This is absurd! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.36.195.201 (talk) 14:40, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

Structure of article

There are two historical sections, and there is more detail about the U.S. than about Europe. The article (although I haven't checked its progression over the years) seems to have developed rather unevenly and could do with a complete makeover. I don't think I'm the person to do it. What I could do is try sometime to tighten up the paragraph beginning with the reference to "later Europe". (What does this mean?)Chrisemms (talk) 23:13, 1 November 2011 (UTC)

Nutritional data needs better source

The table of "Typical nutritional analysis of hulled hemp seeds" is cited to ""Wilde Country Rancho Hemp Products", a commercial site, which claims the data is from thehempnut.com, which claims the data is from "The Hempnut Cookbook: Tasty, Omega-Rich Meals from Hempseed", ISBN-13: 978-1570671425. Recently someone changed the numbers in the table, but did not change the citation, so I reverted that. But we need a better source than a cookbook from "a food company specializing in researching, developing,and marketing hempseed foods". --John Nagle (talk) 07:58, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

Some recent refs need improvement

A recent edit added: "

Industrial hemp production in France

France is Europe's biggest producer with 8,000 hectares cultivated. 70-80 % of the hemp fibre produced in Europe in 2003 was used for specialty pulp for cigarette papers and technical applications. About 15% is used in the automotive sector and 5-6% were used for insulation mats. Approximately 95% of hurds were used as animal bedding, while almost 5% were used in the building sector. In 2010/2011 was the total area cultivated with hemp in the EU about 11 000 ha, a decline compared with previous year.Jordbruksverket: 2.1–2.3, 2.5 Marknadssituationen för spannmål, oljeväxter, proteingrödor, ris,2011-03-10,(Report from an expert group in the European Union about the market situation for a number of agricultural products. Published only in Swedish)"

This seems to be a Swedish summary of a European Union report, with one line that mentions hemp. We should find the original. --John Nagle (talk) 21:07, 3 March 2012 (UTC)

Hemp allergy

Removed claims that there are no allergies to hemp. See [12]. (Popa, V., Gavrilescu, N., Preda, N., Teculescu, D., Plecias, M., and Cîrstea, M. (1969).Brit. J. industr. Med.,26, 101-108. An investigation of allergy in byssinosis: sensitization to cotton, hemp, flax, and jute antigens.) Allergic reactions to hemp, flax, and jute (all bast fibers) have all been found in textile workers, at roughly the same levels. There are anecdotal reports of allergic reactions to hemp on line, but few reliable sources. Also see [13] re hemp pollen allergy. --John Nagle (talk) 17:17, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

File:Hempnutcomposition.gif Nominated for Deletion

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Nutrition: Hempseed oil's effect on the balance of essential fatty acids (EFAs)

Under the nutrition section, the article states "Unlike flaxseed oil, hemp oil can be used continuously without developing a deficiency or other imbalance of EFAs.[24] This has been demonstrated in a clinical study, where the daily ingestion of flaxseed oil decreased the endogenous production of GLA.[24]"

This contradicts the reference cited. In that study's conclusion, the authors claim: "The HO [hemp oil] period resulted in higher proportions of both LA and gamma-linolenic acid in serum cholesteryl esters (CE) and triglycerides (TG) as compared with the FO period (P < 0.001), whereas the FO [flax oil] period resulted in a higher proportion of ALA in both serum CE and TG as compared with the HO period (P < 0.001)." This indicates that BOTH flax and hemp oils effect the balance of ALA to LA in the body.

This is especially concerning for vegetarians who do not consume fish and get their omega-3 oil from flax instead. If an individual does not consume DHA in the diet (primarily found in fish), the body must convert it from ALA. However this is a very inefficient process to begin with and eating foods high in LA further restrict the production of DHA because of competing enzyme conversion pathways of ALA and LA. DHA is essential to proper brain functioning.

Endless being (talk) 04:56, 20 March 2012 (UTC)endless being 2012.03.19

This article has arbitrary information

Since it was rewritten, the article shows arbitrary information and factual errors. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.194.124.2 (talk) 10:31, 7 April 2012 (UTC)

Ford's Hemp Body Car (1941)

There's no reference to the famous Henry Ford's Hemp Body Car (1941) that used a fuel entirely made with hemp ethanol, and the body of the car itself was made with a plastic obtained by hemp.

Here are the links: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54vD_cPCQM8&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rgDyEO_8cI

And here's an original article from Henry Ford himself:

http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/1941-henry-ford-plastic-hemp-body-car-original — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.12.83.86 (talk) 13:19, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

That's because it actually used "soybean fiber in a phenolic resin with formaldehyde used in the impregnation".[14] See Soybean_Car. In the early days of plastics, many organic materials were tried as fillers.[15]. Most did not work well. There were some successes with organic fillers in phenolic interior parts like instrument panel knobs, but the materials would swell up when wet, so they were not usable for exterior parts. --John Nagle (talk) 17:27, 14 April 2012 (UTC)

Hemp contains 0.3% THC?

Hey all!

The opening paragraph says " Typically, hemp contains below 0.3% THC, while cultivars of Cannabis grown for recreational use can contain anywhere from 2% to over 20%".

What does this percentage refer to? The complete plant (probably not), the flower buds, the flower resin..? Thanks for an answer on that one! 109.160.134.28 (talk) 15:35, 27 May 2012 (UTC)

Levi's jeans not made of hemp

Update to preserve link lost through site update: Levi's jeans history [16] from archive.org. See also Amoskeag Manufacturing Company, which made the fabric. --John Nagle (talk) 21:32, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

Old bogus claims creeping back in

The "hemp car" claim crept back in. See Soybean Car for the real story. --John Nagle (talk) 03:34, 19 October 2012 (UTC)

Article clearly needs to mention/discuss conspiracy theories and myths

There are so many conspiracy theories and myths regarding hemp, I was shocked to see they aren't addressed approppriately in the main namespace. They are clearly a notable aspect of the subject, and looking back through the talk page evidences this. They should be debunked and discussed in an encyclopedic sense in the article; the reason I came to this article was because I thought the most objective place to see an explanation of these myths would be my old faithful Wikipedia!

154.20.65.60 (talk) 14:01, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

If this article is lacking, then why not help contribute? Which specific myths are most prevalent? --Thoric (talk) 21:42, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

As I said, and you presumably read, a look back through the talk page archive shows the conspiracy theories / lies repeatedly. I am also fed up with readers taking the time to be helpful and trying to suggest improvements on talk pages that they perhaps do not have either the time, knowledge, expertise, or energy to implement in the main namespace themselves being basically and dismissively told to do it themselves. I was trying to help by making the suggestion. Perhaps you could likewise help contribute, instead of just taking the time to point out that you don't think I've helped yet. I've helped on subjects I feel qualified to help on.

207.216.83.226 (talk) 19:02, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

Cheaper to produce paper from hemp

The article currently states from citation 37 that hemp is not commercially used to produce paper because of high processing cost. According to the U.S. Dept. of Agriculture, one acre of hemp can produce 4 times more paper than one acre of trees. Trees must grow for 20 to 50 years after planting before they can be harvested for commercial use. Within 4 months after it is planted, hemp grows 10 to 20 feet tall and it is ready for harvesting. The Article in its current state is misleading. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.13.53.93 (talk) 13:52, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

The Library of Congress found that, “While the hemp paper in volumes 300-400 years old is still strong, 97% of the books, printed between 1900 and 1937 on tree paper, will be useable for less than 50 years.”

Hemp paper doesn’t require toxic bleaching chemicals. It can be whitened with hydrogen peroxide, which doesn’t poison waterways as chloride and bleach--the chemicals used in making wood pulp paper--do.

Hemp fiber produces rope and cloth which is strong and resilient. Hemp makes pulp and other paper products cheaper, cleaner and more efficiently than wood. Hemp pulp can be used as a biomass fuel, with much less negative side effects such as air pollution, and could some day replace petroleum as the primary (and importantly, a home-grown) source of fuel in the US. Hemp may also be consumed as a cheap source of protein and is believed to have many medical applications. http://www1.american.edu/ted/hemp.htm — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.13.53.93 (talk) 14:54, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

Yield per acre is not relevant to processing costs, nor are the other myriad of potential uses for hemp that you mentioned. The processing costs mentioned are the costs for processing raw hemp into pulp suitable for making paper. The article has a reference that supports the statement that these costs are high so the statement stands. If you want to challenge that, you just need references (from reliable sources) that state that the processing costs for making paper out of hemp are not high. It's that simple. All these other things you mentioned are not relevant to that statement and in fact sound suspiciously like soap boxing. Besides most of them are already mentioned in the article; the ones that aren't can be added provided (again) that the claims are verifiable with reliable sources. Cheers, Dusty|💬|You can help! 17:18, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

still misleading. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.42.51.27 (talk) 22:14, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

It's cheaper to make pulp from wood than hemp? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.42.51.27 (talk) 22:21, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

The simle answer is that paper from hemp become too expensive, it has been tested by in countries where production of hemp is legal and the reslut is that paper from hemp become outcomepted by paper form forests or reyceled papaper. ----

Chinese Character

There is a .gif of the Chinese character for hemp in the beginning of the article with a caption explaining it, and a static image of the exact same Chinese character with the exact same caption under the History section. Why not just move the .gif from the beginning of the article to where the static image is and remove the static image? I see no need for both, and the .gif looks a little out of place where it is now.

Cases3 (talk) 18:41, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

This article has no mention of Canadian hemp production

Somebody need to check the stats on Canadian hemp production and include it in this article. My understanding is that Canada is the #2 source of hemp products for the US market — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.197.170.142 (talk) 19:18, 25 August 2013 (UTC)

Nutritional data

The source cited for the nutritional analysis ("Wilde Country Rancho Hemp Products", reference number 10) may be unreliable. That site specifies only "Nutrition Information Copyright 1999-2000 HempNut, Inc. www.TheHempNut.com.", which is currently down.

I recommend that the nutrition info in this article be updated to use this site as its source, as it goes into detail on methodology and cites reputable sources ("Materials and methods" section). 101.170.170.147 (talk) 03:29, 18 January 2014 (UTC)

nutritional information

The article does not contain nutritional information pertaining to in shell toasted hemp seeds as these would have a different nutrition profile than the raw hulled seed. This has made the article rather useless in my scenario but thanks for the other info.

96.42.117.51 (talk) 20:41, 25 February 2014 (UTC) 2:41 PM 2/25/2014

Producers- Russia Section

The Russia section under Producers appears to only exist to point to a website. I do not know much about that website but didn't feel I should remove it. I cleaned up the text of that section but left it largely intact. ACanadianToker (talk) 03:33, 28 May 2014 (UTC)

The site asserts it's for informational purposes only, and not to sell anything, though I haven't examined the entire site, nor read any of the articles (my time is highly limited now). Google translate allows you to view it and probably understand 80-90% of its text. I note one of the articles is titled "bong", a type of water pipe used to smoke cannabis. My impression is the site is primarily of information for growers. If the site and accompanying article text remains as a citation, depending on feedback here, the link to it should probably be piped through Google translate for the convenience of English-only readers. Gzuufy (talk) 17:30, 28 May 2014 (UTC)

Hemp farming and cannabis use by USA presidents

I deleted some unsourced and poorly-sourced information. Please use reliable sources (WP:SOURCE). The journals of George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, etc., are available online. If a non-reliable source (or reliable source) claims something is written in the journal of one of these statesmen, it is not very difficult to verify that by looking up the actual journal entry. Thanks. Paisarepa (talk) 20:47, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

This page vs other languages

The articles in other languges link directly to Fiber, which, whereas those articles are mostly about the fiber, is not correct, as these cover other aspects too. I checked "edit links", but strangely enough it shows that the links go to the page name and not the section name. Anyonw know how to sort this out? Rui ''Gabriel'' Correia (talk) 17:20, 16 August 2014 (UTC)

Nutrition, again

There were some arguments over hemp seeds being a "complete protein". I found a paper with the Protein Digestibility Corrected Amino Acid Score values for hemp seeds, shelled and unshelled, and put them in the article. Hemp seeds come in around 0.66, in the neighbourhood of wheat bread, legumes, and peanuts, which is about what one would expect. (The scale goes from 0 to 1. Soy powder is 1.0, above even beef at 0.92.) John Nagle (talk) 20:13, 6 August 2014 (UTC)

So it IS a complete protein then? Even though soy has a higher score the actual nutritional benefit depends on what other foods you combine it with in a diet. Also its a great source of essential fatty acids and monounsaturated fats which must make it pretty nutritional as in my opinion protein tastes pretty good mixed with some of the healthiest fats and when you combine foods those limiting amino acids can become nicely balanced and the excess acids still contribute a lot if you eat a balanced diet. Dracoshempemporium (talk) 23:36, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

Strength of Hemp Fiber

The Fiber section of this article is much too modest. It briefly mentions some uses of the fiber and the economic impact but no mention of the strength or length of the fibers in any way. I was particularly looking for information on the strength of hemp fibers more particularly in comparison to those of cotton. Dracoshempemporium (talk) 22:18, 24 September 2014 (UTC)

There are some measured values here.[17] Hemp is comparable to flax or linseed. Here are some figures for various bast fibers. Note that you have to convert diameter to area and divide by that to get tensile strength per cross section.[18]. The winner on tensile strength among the bast fibers seems to be sisal, which is the most popular fiber for string and twine. Cotton is not a bast fiber, and the processing is very different, so direct comparison of individual fiber strength is hard. There's both cotton and hemp rope; hemp rope is stronger in the same size, but rots. (It rots from the inside out, so it looks fine until it breaks. (Sailing ships phased hemp rope out starting around 1850 or so, once manila rope came in. In turn, synthetics have taken over most marine applications.) [19]. John Nagle (talk) 06:21, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

Ok. Thanks a bunch for your response! I should have been more specific though. I was attempting to prove or disprove the phrase "Hemp fiber is 10 times stronger than cotton and can be used to make all types of clothing." Well I know it can be used to make any type of clothing that isn't specifically not hemp but I wonder if anyone has ever constructed fibers of equal diameter hemp versus cotton and hung weights from them. Dracoshempemporium (talk) 17:30, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

What do you mean by "stronger"? Wear resistance? Tensile strength? In general, the bast fibers are stronger than cotton, but not as comfortable to wear. Sisal is stronger than hemp, but while sisal clothing exists, it's not popular. The strength of cotton can be increased; see mercerized cotton. Cotton/polyester blends are much stronger and longer-lasting than pure cotton. For raw tensile strength, there's ballistic nylon and Kevlar. As for the article, we can probably leave out "Hemp fiber is 10 times stronger than cotton and can be used to make all types of clothing", which appears uncited on a number of promotional sites for hemp John Nagle (talk) 21:45, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

Ok thanks again. I meant pure hemp fiber of a given area and exactly the same shape as a control fiber of pure cotton with exactly the same dimensions tested against each other. To specify I mostly meant tensile strength but if there was any raw data out there about wear resistance that would probably help too. Dracoshempemporium (talk) 23:25, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

Woo. That was a doozy of a book you cited. Very informative really. Well is it safe to say that hemp fibers are MANY times stronger than cotton fibers and can be produced with MUCH less water and little to no fertilizer? I think after the part where it reads " Pure hemp has a texture similar to linen." It should include some of this data you have presented or similar indicating the different statistics on strength of hemp fiber. This important information seems lacking from the article. Perhaps sometime I will take the time to edit it in. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dracoshempemporium (talk • contribs) 21:13, 26 September 2014 (UTC)

Environmental Impact

Under the Environmental Impact section it states that it is claimed that hemp requires little to no fertilizer with HIA as citation. It then claims that high yield hemp crops may require high nutrients similar to high yield wheat crops. And cites [66] as its source. Which takes you to http://www.agriculture.gov.sk.ca/Default.aspx?DN=e60e706d-c852-4206-9959-e4b134782175. The Sasketchewan department of agriculture website Where it states "Research data on soil fertility is limited. Currently, results indicate that hemp may require total nutrient levels (field plus fertilizer nutrients) similar to a high yielding wheat crop, approximately100 kg N/ha (90 lb. N/ac.); 50 kg P 2O5/ha(45 lb. P2O5/ac.); 67 kg K2O/ha (60 lb. K2O/ac.) and 17 kg S/ha (15 lb. S/ac.). Soil testing to determine soil nutrient levels is recommended. Recent research at Melfort Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada (AAFC) showed increases in seed yield,biomass, plant height and protein content were achieved as nitrogen fertilizer was increased up to 120 kg/ha (107 lb./ac.).Nitrogen is best side-banded, mid-row-banded or banded in a separate operation, as hemp seed may be sensitive to seed-placed N fertilizer. Excess rates of N can negatively affect fibre quality.

This page is admitting that the research for this claim was limited. And please notice that only the part after Recent Research at Melfort is cited by this original source in anyway. So this citation is actually citing an uncited original source. It is no citation at all. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dracoshempemporium (talk • contribs) 21:33, 26 September 2014 (UTC) Dracoshempemporium (talk) 21:38, 26 September 2014 (UTC)

If it's not well-cited, remove it. Here's Oregon State agricultural extension's info on fertilizer for growing hemp.[20]. That source has similar info for other crops, so they're a neutral source. John Nagle (talk) 06:43, 27 September 2014 (UTC)

Error for reference / citation [10] -

Reference / Citation [10] in heading "References" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemp#References) does not SPECIFICALLY link to "'Wilde Country Rancho Hemp Products' Wcranchohemp.com Retrieved 2011-11-30." (http://wcranchohemp.com/) from the table "Typical nutritional analysis of hulled hemp seeds" under heading "Nutrition" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemp#Nutrition). Dcburdi (talk) 18:26, 28 October 2014 (UTC) David C. Burdick

Relevant or not

One user did not like that I added links to a source that show that hemp hurds was vaste (hemp hurds is the part of the hemp stem that don¨t contain long fiber). Hemp hurds was in 1937 not used by paper mills. Jack Herers theory claim that the newsprint king Hearst had a financial interest in a ban for Hemp. The claim is based on the assumption that "hemp hurds" could become a "threat" for Hearst timber holdings as a raw material for paper.

An article from 1937 give this information:

- Demand for cellulose was increasing FLAX AND HEMP: FROM THE SEED TO THE LOOM, Mechanical Engineering Magazine, February 1937 - Hemp was a possible alternative. but the process making paper from hemp hurds was in 1937 only a vision, not something that paper mills used in the US or Canada. - Other sources show that important improvements were made in how to deink recycled waste paper.US Patent 2077059 A, 1937

Newsprint from recycled paper was a much more realistic alternative than paper from hemp hurds. Paper from the long fibers in hemp had become too expensive. Jack Herers theory about hemp hurds could become a "threat" to Hearst profits has very low credibility. As I see it is relevant to add information that oppose Jack Herers theory about a "treat" from hemp. Dala11a (talk) 16:28, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

Dala11a. Although your information may be factual history, it is more detailed than is necessary for an encyclopedia; see WP:NOT and I have reverted your edits, so WP:CONSENSUS applies. Also, it appears English is not your native language so please practice writing content in your sandbox or post edits first on the Talk page for other editors to determine whether to include the information and edit it. Lastly, please do not edit war, WP:EW. Thanks. --Zefr (talk) 18:58, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

You avoids answering the question of why you think the text is too deeply into the details. Jack Herer sold more that 600 000 books about hemp and many believed himDala11a (talk) 20:17, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

I would say enough text is devoted to Hearst, a speculative discussion anyway as no proof exists about the role he or his businesses played in inhibiting the hemp industry in the 1930s. Secondly, there were too many details about the hemp fibers for a general reader of the encyclopedia. The remaining statements are adequately referenced. --Zefr (talk) 21:01, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

Some of the classic bogus info from Jack Herer is creeping back in. We've dealt with most of that before; see the archives of the talk page, especially at Talk:Hemp/Archive_2#Removed bogus info from hemp sites. John Nagle (talk) 08:08, 24 February 2015 (UTC)

Strength of hemp fiber

I wanted to revive this discussion. I dont think my question has been answered yet. Thank you. Dracoshempemporium (talk) 00:43, 6 March 2015 (UTC)

Strength of Hemp Fiber

The Fiber section of this article is much too modest. It briefly mentions some uses of the fiber and the economic impact but no mention of the strength or length of the fibers in any way. I was particularly looking for information on the strength of hemp fibers more particularly in comparison to those of cotton. Dracoshempemporium (talk) 22:18, 24 September 2014 (UTC)

   There are some measured values here.[17] Hemp is comparable to flax or linseed. Here are some figures for various bast fibers. Note that you have to convert diameter to area and divide by that to get tensile strength per cross section.[18]. The winner on tensile strength among the bast fibers seems to be sisal, which is the most popular fiber for string and twine. Cotton is not a bast fiber, and the processing is very different, so direct comparison of individual fiber strength is hard. There's both cotton and hemp rope; hemp rope is stronger in the same size, but rots. (It rots from the inside out, so it looks fine until it breaks. (Sailing ships phased hemp rope out starting around 1850 or so, once manila rope came in. In turn, synthetics have taken over most marine applications.) [19]. John Nagle (talk) 06:21, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

       Ok. Thanks a bunch for your response! I should have been more specific though. I was attempting to prove or disprove the phrase "Hemp fiber is 10 times stronger than cotton and can be used to make all types of clothing." Well I know it can be used to make any type of clothing that isn't specifically not hemp but I wonder if anyone has ever constructed fibers of equal diameter hemp versus cotton and hung weights from them. Dracoshempemporium (talk) 17:30, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

           What do you mean by "stronger"? Wear resistance? Tensile strength? In general, the bast fibers are stronger than cotton, but not as comfortable to wear. Sisal is stronger than hemp, but while sisal clothing exists, it's not popular. The strength of cotton can be increased; see mercerized cotton. Cotton/polyester blends are much stronger and longer-lasting than pure cotton. For raw tensile strength, there's ballistic nylon and Kevlar. As for the article, we can probably leave out "Hemp fiber is 10 times stronger than cotton and can be used to make all types of clothing", which appears uncited on a number of promotional sites for hemp John Nagle (talk) 21:45, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

Ok thanks again. I meant pure hemp fiber of a given area and exactly the same shape as a control fiber of pure cotton with exactly the same dimensions tested against each other. To specify I mostly meant tensile strength but if there was any raw data out there about wear resistance that would probably help too. Dracoshempemporium (talk) 23:25, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

Woo. That was a doozy of a book you cited. Very informative really. Well is it safe to say that hemp fibers are MANY times stronger than cotton fibers and can be produced with MUCH less water and little to no fertilizer? I think after the part where it reads " Pure hemp has a texture similar to linen." It should include some of this data you have presented or similar indicating the different statistics on strength of hemp fiber. This important information seems lacking from the article. Perhaps sometime I will take the time to edit it in. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dracoshempemporium (talk • contribs) 21:13, 26 September 2014 (UTC)

supercapacitors

i just removed the following:

In a new development hemp is being processed relatively inexpensively into electrodes possibly even more efficient than graphene for use in supercapacitors.

References

There was a lot of hype over a presentation given at ACS, but little actual reporting. Doing some digging, the startup mentioned that was meant to be making this real, is Alta Supercaps and as you can see from their website it is out of business. All Catlin did by the way was treat biowaste (yes from hemp) to make a graphene-like material. Not necessarily will involve hemp at commercial scale, and may never become anything. Content was WP:CRYSTALBALL and looking dim, at present. We can add back if and when this ever does become commercial. Jytdog (talk) 14:34, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

US House Bill 525

Could it include the current legislation that is moving through the US Congress? There are bills like S.134 and H.R.525 that would enable article readers to quickly track the American lawmakers and the sentiment of the US Government.

House Bill 525

Usulutan86 (talk) 20:06, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia is WP:NOTNEWS nor is it place for advocacy, per WP:NOTADVOCACY. Many bills are proposed and go no where - there are not encyclopedia worthy, necessarily. Jytdog (talk) 01:28, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

I believe the whole text about hemp is really well informed and has tones of information about the plant. The only thing that I would like to suggest for the improvement is to have more information about hemp fibers, I did not see much about it. And also talk a little bit more about the legalization in the world since is still a tabu for our society. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.85.144.33 (talk) 06:48, 3 October 2015 (UTC)

Lack of Political/Legal Information and Context

It appears that this article has been largely developed by hemp advocates who are dismissive of the political and legal objections to hemp, thus leaving the entire article devoid of any real discussion of these decisive issues (except for a couple of paragraphs of "conspiracy theory" about the reasons for the U.S. outlawing hemp, not mentioning any of the normally cited, and most obvious, reasons).

• it should be noted that such "discussion" does not belong on the wiki page proper, but rather in the "discussion/talk" section.

• The only "normally cited" or "obvious" reason to federally outlaw such products is the presence of psychoactive components. Considering no fewer than 26 varieties are now internationally recognized as fulfilling the requirement of being non-psychoactive, there are no further reasons, obvious or otherwise, to prohibit it via federal law. The claim that hemp production may not be necessary or fiscally viable is not a valid reason for a federal ban on production. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.176.89.122 (talk) 19:23, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

Shocking lack of objectivity and relevance in this article, as a consequence. Legalizing hemp (for "industrial" use) has become one of the key schemes used by marijuana-legalization advocates, as a way to chip away at anti-marijuana laws (which typically outlaw hemp, a variant of marijuana).

Clearly not a thorough, and fully honest, objective coverage of the subject.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Zxtxtxz (talk • contribs) 22:32, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

External links modified

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Proposal to come to consensus

"Hemp is not to be confused with the close relative of the herb Cannabis which is widely used as a drug, commonly known as marijuana. These variants are typically low-growing and have higher content of tetrahydrocannabinol (THC), cannabidiol (CBD), and other cannabinoids".

The above is the current second sentence of the article. This could probably be greatly improved with a few sources. I propose we come up with good sources to actually define what hemp is, and then we make changes to the article based on what we find during our research.

Hemp is not to be confused with the close relative of the herb Cannabis which is widely used as a drug, commonly known as marijuana.

I contend Hemp and Cannabis are, basically the same thing... these are just two different names for a plant.

Does anybody know of any reliable sources that say that "cannabis" and "hemp" are different? --Potguru (talk) 07:18, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

There's a ton, but again, you are misreading the difference. It's not a different taxonomy per se, but different word usage, in this case "cannabis" the drug not "Cannabis" the genus. In this context, hemp is used for non-drug uses, historically as a fiber, whereas in comparison, the term cannabis is used to refer to its use as a drug. Viriditas (talk) 21:54, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

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Move to Cannabis (industrial uses)?

I reverted it back to Hemp, the reason for this, is because no consensus had been reached to move it to Cannabis (industrial uses), and hemp is in fact, the most common and standard name for the industrial uses of cannabis, namely, industrial hemp (no one calls it "industrial cannabis"). Hemp is also the actual name for cannabis in English (and all Germanic languages have similar cognates, such as sv:Hampa, da:Almindelig_Hamp, de:Hanf_(Art), nl:Hennep, no:Hamp and so on; English shouldn't be the exception. Cannabis is the original name, but in the Germanic languages, it evolved into "hemp". I also reverted all your edits back to last version by Lipsquid, and some of your edits were good, but you shouldn't remove sources. You can add new sources but keep the ones that are already in use. As for this edit, I plan on expanding the hemp seed article into a serious article, just give me a few more days, so please keep it for now. I also don't understand this edit, why remove a good picture like that? HempFan (talk) 14:22, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

I have restored the source content....pls do not revert to unsourced version with unsourced info. Why you would remove so many sources and add back reftags all over is pullzaling Clearly your edit was detrimental to the article thus was reverted on the spot WP:BURDEN. Can you explain why you would do this and what info do you believe was taken out that is of value? As for the move we did tlak about it Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Cannabis#‎Draft:Marijuana (cannabis)...but perhaps best to tlak about it here.-- Moxy (talk) 14:53, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

The sources you added I assume are fine (I haven't gone through them), but you actually did remove some sources, like for example, here and here, why? You shouldn't remove perfectly valid sources; add new sources, that's all fine, but please don't remove sources, unless they're not reliable (per WP:RS). And you also removed a good, descriptive picture here, why? As for the name, an argument could be made that it should be moved to industrial hemp, but cannabis (industrial uses) is a weaker argument, and that would make the article more difficult to find for one thing (such as through a disambiguation page), and the name of the species is cannabis, whereas in the common English vernacular, it's called simply "hemp", case in point; is Woody Harrelson referring to it as "cannabis for industrial uses"? No, everyone calls it "hemp", plain and simple. The name of this article, as "Hemp", is standard procedure per WP:NAME guidelines. HempFan (talk) 15:39, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

I will assume your revert was done because you did not like the move. The sources your talking about were not reliable and replaced by reliable sources...in fact two of the sources had failed verification tags in the second example you give above... as for the first source the Goverment of Canada one it was replaced with two sources that go into detail about many countries not just Canada. You aslo removed source that were added because people where asking forthem ...you deleted them and added back the facttags. Perhaps best you read the source over before removing them in the future. As for the title that can be debated again here..does not rely matter to me as long as the info here is sourced....Search hemp oil vs Cannabis oil you will be surprised at the results.-- Moxy (talk) 15:52, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

I just reverted it to the last version by Lipsquid, which was the last version before you began editing it. I didn't do this to remove your sources, but to change it back to the version before you did the move. Now, we can debate the new sources you added and the other sources you removed and their reliability or lack thereof, but I think the name of this article, should simply be Hemp, because a) it's the most common name for the industrial variety of cannabis, and so the article should reflect that, and b) there's no need to disambiguate the article's title. The article Cannabis is for the species in general (including both the recreational drug and the industrial variety), marijuana is for the drug, and hemp should be for the industrial variety. Why complicate it when there's no need to do that? And yes, I know the difference between cannabis oil and hemp oil, I'm the HempFan here, remember? ;) HempFan (talk) 16:00, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

You are aware that hemp and marijuana have different meaning around the world correct?...many places see hemp and marijuana has parts of the same plant where others see them as different types of plants in the same family. That said as long as your not blanking the refs again I dont have a problem with the move back.....as all is explained in the article. -- Moxy (talk) 16:07, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

Yes, and if I were to have it my way, I'd move the marijuana article to hemp (recreational drug), because hemp is the correct name even for the drug variety. But I'm following WP:NAME. I will look through your new sources and the old sources you removed, later. I do however, think you should revert that edit you did when you removed the picture; no need to remove that. HempFan (talk) 16:12, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

This is not a valid rationale to move the article to an improper title, I suggest you undo the move. Also, use the talk page and reach a consensus instead of assuming I'm wrong based on you having more edits than me. HempFan (talk) 19:55, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

Google gives 495 000 hits for "industrial hemp", and only 10 900 hits for "industrial cannabis", so it makes no sense to move the page to Cannabis (industrial uses), because the only industry (to the extent that it's legal) cannabis has, is for smoking pot; it's not used in other industries (well, medical marijuana is one thing, but that too is to a large extent also smoked). Its industrial name is by far most commonly known as hemp, or industrial hemp. Since hemp is the actual, correct name for the entire species in the English/Germanic languages, if anything, it would be more linguistically accurate to move the Cannabis (drug) article to Hemp (drug) instead of moving this article to Cannabis (industrial uses). As it is today however, cannabis has become the standard name for the drug, and hemp has become the standard name for the industrial subspecies of the plant. HempFan (talk) 21:15, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

• Oppose NOTE: This is all a reaction to the fact that people do not want to recognize marijuana as "part of the cannabis plant" with the balance being "hemp". Sources are good and well understood but there are certain editors on this site who refuse to acknowledge the term marijuana exists and has meaning. Clearly any reasonable encyclopedia would contain entries for hemp and marijuana separately from an article about cannabis, just the same as wikipedia has separate articles about mescaline and peyote and just as wikipedia has separate articles on heroin and opium. The conversation should remain where it started, here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Cannabis#Draft:Marijuana_.28cannabis.29 --Potguru (talk) 21:38, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

• In my view the move from Hemp >> Cannabis (industrial uses) was overly BOLD. Not heinous, just overly BOLD. There is a process for discussing possibly controversial page moves, as mentioned here and described in detail Wikipedia:Requested_moves#Requesting_controversial_and_potentially_controversial_moves. Here is what I suggest. Moxy, would you please consent to restoring this page to its former location at Hemp, and then would you please follow the appropriate process to get consensus to move the page here? This would be the most consensus-minded way to resolve this problem. Please let me know. Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 21:47, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

• @ HempFan. We are not assuming you are wrong. I take a little part-time historical interest in herbalism. Very early recipes are often meaningless today as they refer to the plants by their local names whose names differed from locality to locality, thus, modern scholars can only guess as to what plant they are referring to and the people back in those times could not fully benefit from other peoples knowledge because they didn't have a universal nomenclature. By the time Mrs. M. Grieve published her works, local names where backed up by a widely understood botanical taxonomy. Making it possible for everyone, no matter where, to benefit. So her book, “The Modern Herbal” is still useful and readily understandable even today. This is how the vast body of human knowledge progresses and grows. Each generation picks though any existing confusion and fits it into -what is already known- in a way that is easier to follow. At the same time it untangles errors and superstitions of primitive folk. The same goes for paleontology, biology and other sciences. Diversification (forking), as your suggesting, is a step backwards. It leads back to the tower of Babel.--Aspro (talk) 21:55, 15 May 2016 (UTC)
  • The most common name for the industrial variety of cannabis, is simply, hemp or industrial hemp. This is a fact, and WP:NAME#Use commonly recognizable names policy states that the most common name should be used. So not only am I not wrong on the fact that hemp is the standardized name for the industry variety of cannabis, but I'm also the one in agreement with Wikipedia policy here. Please be rational and revert the move. HempFan (talk) 22:03, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

• Oppose this move. Hemp is a good, solid title that is easy to remember and widely used to describe a wide range of uses for the plant. Just getting in to register my vote for when we actually have a proper discussion about the validity of this BOLD move. At the end of the day, keeping it simple is usually preferable, and the new title seems needlessly complex and non-intuitive. Mabalu (talk) 22:06, 15 May 2016 (UTC)
• Oppose by me as well, per Mabalu above and everything else I've written on this talk page. HempFan (talk) 22:09, 15 May 2016 (UTC)
• Everybody please settle down. I've asked Moxy if they will consent to moving this back and starting a move discussion. Please give them a chance to respond. There is no Huge Tragedy here and there is no WP:NODEADLINE - we can probably resolve this simply if Moxy consents, as they should. Please be patient. Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 22:15, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

As i said before I dont really care about the title in this case....was moved after a small talk about it at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Cannabis#Draft:Marijuana (cannabis). All I care about is that the source dont get deleted again. We now we have a odd merger request at Cannabis (drug) to deal with...hard to spend my time fixing articles when we have to spend so much time dealing with odd edits and requests.-- Moxy (talk) 22:31, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for replying! The thing we need to resolve this is your consent to move it back for now. Is that OK with you? Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 22:35, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

Yes move back is fine....we can just start a new talk if others want to - pls leave redirect as its been change by me and others in articles. -- Moxy (talk) 22:41, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

Thank you so much! Done. If you want to do a move request, please feel free. Your argument for doing it is not bad. Jytdog (talk) 00:10, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

Genus vs species

I changed the lead a little bit because Cannabis is the genus, Cannabis sativa is the species, and hemp is a variety of the Cannabis sativa species.[21] —PermStrump(talk) 16:40, 18 May 2016 (UTC)

I think it should be pointed out that hemp actually is the older name for cannabis in English and also similar cognates in the other Germanic languages. I mean, did English speaking people in the let's say, 15th century, actually call the drug variety, "cannabis"? If I'm not mistaken, they called it hemp back then, or hænep as already mentioned in the article. It's mainly in recent years, since it became illegal, that the name hemp has come to denote the non-THC variety. HempFan (talk) 22:16, 18 May 2016 (UTC)

Funny timing b/c I was about to post here about why I think we should add an etymology subsection under History and remove the Old English from the lead. The plant wikiproject has a shortcut that was named for this exact scenario: WP:PLANTS/NOTABOUTNAME. "Plant articles about groups of plants (taxa) are about the plants, not about the name of the group, and the opening of the article should reflect this." Not a perfect fit but I think it can be adapted to this scenario. I do think the Old English is an interesting tidbit, but it's not something that's mentioned in the sources unless I explicitly search for "hemp etymology" or "hemp old english". If this were a BLP article, I'd say it's not WP:DEFINING, but I don't know what the plant equivalent to that would be. —PermStrump(talk) 22:43, 18 May 2016 (UTC)

I think Old English in the lead is fine, and helpful in that it links to the etymology article. However, I do agree on an etymology subsection. HempFan (talk) 23:01, 18 May 2016 (UTC)

Permstrump, what do you think of this edit? It could need some sourcing though, if you could fix that, it would be great. HempFan (talk) 23:51, 18 May 2016 (UTC)

Etymology section added

Okay Permstrump, I've added it now: Hemp#Etymology. I wrote it based on what's known. Would be very helpful if you or someone else could help out with the sources and all that extra stuff. HempFan (talk) 00:32, 19 May 2016 (UTC)