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Q1: Can I write a message to Elon Musk here? (No.)
A1: No. The "Talk:Elon Musk" page is not for writing messages to Musk. It is only for discussing changes to the Wikipedia article about him. Writing a message to Musk here is pointless and disruptive, and such messages will be removed as an improper use of the page. Q2: Can you update the article to call Musk a "business magnet"? (No.)
A2: No. Musk once suggested in an interview that his Wikipedia article be changed to describe him as a "business magnet" rather than a magnate. The tone of that interview was not very serious; he also claimed to be an alien.[1] Wikipedia doesn't have to do what Musk says, and this request has been made and declined dozens of times already. New requests may be removed without a response so that other discussions are not disrupted. Q3: Should Musk be identified as South African in the opening sentence?
A3: Musk is a US citizen (since 2002) born and raised in South Africa, and also acquired Canadian citizenship via his mother. Including these nationalities in the opening sentence in a balanced way would be complex, and the consensus is that they should instead be explained later in the lead. Q4: Can you change "Tesla CEO" to "Tesla Technoking"?
A4: No, because he is still CEO according to company records and that is a common corporate title that readers will understand, unlike "Technoking". The goal of the article is to inform people, which would be hindered by raising a confusing technicality. Q5: Should the mention of Errol Musk having an interest in an emerald mine be removed in view of Elon's denials?
A5: While Elon today vehemently disputes any history with an emerald mine, he formerly accepted and even confirmed it. Specifically, a 2014 report originally printed in the San Jose Mercury News (and cited in the article) stated that Errol Musk had "a stake in" a mine. Elon affirmed his father's mine involvement in an interview with Jim Clash, a career interviewer of public figures, that was published by Forbes and withdrawn without explanation a few months later. Elon biographer Ashlee Vance likewise confirmed Errol's mining interest, with Elon's objections but not denials, in a 2020 interview report with Elon. Errol has stated that he received hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of emeralds from his dealings. Q6: Should "Bachelor of Arts in Physics" be "Bachelor of Science" instead?
A6: No. Although it may seem counterintuitive, "Bachelor of Arts in Physics" is the degree that the University of Pennsylvania (among other schools) awards. Q7: Should the article acknowledge doubts about Musk's academic record?
A7: Wikipedia policy on biographies of living persons requires that negative information about a person must be attributed to reliable published sources, and excludes both self-published sources (e.g. Twitter threads) and court trial records. The article states that sources disagree about when Musk obtained bachelor degrees, and that he did not attend Stanford for any significant amount of time. Any doubts beyond this require appropriate sources. Q8: Why doesn't this article describe Musk as an engineer?
A8: Musk is chief engineer of SpaceX, a title that applies within the company and that the press regularly mentions. He is not a professional engineer, a distinction within engineering that carries certain legal privileges in the United States, nor has he completed an engineering training program, nor has he ever been hired as an engineer. The article therefore does not include any of these claims. It does note that, from time to time, Musk has made initial product proposals at his companies that his trained engineers then research and develop. He does hold IEEE Honorary Membership. Q9: Why doesn't the article identify Musk as co-founder of PayPal?
A9: Because that could mislead readers that Musk was involved in the creation of the PayPal service and brand, when he was not. Instead, as the article states, he co-founded a company (X.com Corporation) that acquired the company that had developed PayPal (Confinity Inc.) and then renamed itself as PayPal, Inc. Q10: Why does this page include criticism of Musk's actions and stances?
A10: Musk is criticized/praised a lot in many reliable sources, and as such we need to talk about these criticisms and praise. To quote from Wikipedia's policy on a neutral point of view, articles must represent "fairly, proportionately, and, as far as possible, without editorial bias, all the significant views that have been published by reliable sources on a topic." Q11: Why is this a "good article" when some people consider Musk a bad person?
A11: "Good article" on Wikipedia refers to the way the article is written, not what kind of person Musk is. Good articles have been found to satisfy Wikipedia editorial standards for accuracy, verifiability and balanced presentation. Q12: Why doesn't this page call Musk African American?
A12: African Americans are an ethnic group of Americans with total or partial ancestry from any of the Black racial groups of Africa. Reliable sources do not use this term to describe Musk. References
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Musk's daughter has gone public - time to include her name?
editFirst she wrote a critical response on Threads to Elon's interview, then followed it up with [1] an interview with NBC - and under her name, not an alias / anonymously.
My read is that we should probably include her name now instead of just referencing her indirectly, now that she's no longer trying to remain private (indeed, she refers to herself as "an H-list celebrity" on her Threads account). -- Rei (talk) 02:55, 26 July 2024 (UTC)
- Makes sense to me. WP:BLPNAME is for low-profile persons. I think going public with interviews etc. entails a choice to forgo the privacy of a low-profile, private person. Endwise (talk) 11:57, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 28 July 2024
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Change "12" in infobox ("Children") to "12, including Vivian Jenna Wilson", because an article has been created. J3133 (talk) 08:27, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
On hold until Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Vivian Jenna Wilson is closed. No point in adding the link if it will need to get removed shortly afterwards. If the article is kept, please re-open the request. Left guide (talk) 01:57, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Replace "businessman and investor" with "business magnate" in Lead
editA business magnate is essentially both. It is a more clear way of writing it, like it is done in the articles for Carlos Slim and Li Ka-shing for example. PhotographyEdits (talk) 19:53, 31 July 2024 (UTC)
- In general we've been trying to move away from business magnate and similar because they're value laden labels (its likely that Slim and Li will have it removed at some point), to quote liberally from the page you linked "Such individuals have been known by different terms throughout history, such as robber barons, captains of industry, moguls, oligarchs, plutocrats, or tai-pans." Horse Eye's Back (talk) 20:08, 31 July 2024 (UTC)
- I do think that 'businessman' understates his importance and power. A person with a net worth of 100k USD is also a businessman, but not really a magnate. I would argue using a stronger term here is better. PhotographyEdits (talk) 09:35, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
- A person who identified as a man with 100x money as him who earned it in a similar way would also be a businessman... The second half of the sentence speaks to the importance and power. I would also note that a person with a net worth of zero may also be a business man as can someone with a net worth of negative one billion... Businessman doesn't suggest an income level. If its importance and power you wish to convey than a different value laden label like "plutocrat" or "oligarch" would fit your purposes better, but I don't think we should be using any value laden labels at all. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 17:16, 6 August 2024 (UTC)
- Second. QRep2020 (talk) 13:40, 7 August 2024 (UTC)
- A person who identified as a man with 100x money as him who earned it in a similar way would also be a businessman... The second half of the sentence speaks to the importance and power. I would also note that a person with a net worth of zero may also be a business man as can someone with a net worth of negative one billion... Businessman doesn't suggest an income level. If its importance and power you wish to convey than a different value laden label like "plutocrat" or "oligarch" would fit your purposes better, but I don't think we should be using any value laden labels at all. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 17:16, 6 August 2024 (UTC)
- I do think that 'businessman' understates his importance and power. A person with a net worth of 100k USD is also a businessman, but not really a magnate. I would argue using a stronger term here is better. PhotographyEdits (talk) 09:35, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
- As the FAQ notes, the phrase "business magnate" in this article was a perennial target for frivolous edit requests. 2601:642:4600:D3B0:B948:CE1F:F8AA:83BB (talk) 17:30, 3 August 2024 (UTC)
- That was a pun from himself it seems, and we obviously do not have to honor that one. But it does not object against 'business magnate' it seems. PhotographyEdits (talk) 09:32, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
- Err yes it does Q2: Can you update the article to call Musk a "business magnet"? (No.) A2: No... that seems a pretty clear objection. Slatersteven (talk) 10:51, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
- it says business *magnet* not business *magnATE*. It is a pun from Musk. PhotographyEdits (talk) 12:47, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
- OK, but the talk page archive has the question of "magnATE" raised (and rej4ected), many times. Maybe we need to add this to the FAQ? Slatersteven (talk) 12:54, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
- Check the archives. We discussed this at length already. QRep2020 (talk) 19:48, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
- it says business *magnet* not business *magnATE*. It is a pun from Musk. PhotographyEdits (talk) 12:47, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
- AFAIK, there was no consensus to remove business magnate in the last two discussions (here and here), but the same two editors who wanted it removed invoked WP:BLPRESTORE and that was it. Ptrnext (talk) 06:25, 6 August 2024 (UTC)
- The point in regard to the FAQ is that "business magnate" was a target of disruption, and I promise you that it would be again if it were restored. Musk fans struggle mightily with comedic timing. 2601:642:4600:D3B0:B494:44BE:C294:C4E0 (talk) 02:47, 8 August 2024 (UTC)
- Err yes it does Q2: Can you update the article to call Musk a "business magnet"? (No.) A2: No... that seems a pretty clear objection. Slatersteven (talk) 10:51, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
- That was a pun from himself it seems, and we obviously do not have to honor that one. But it does not object against 'business magnate' it seems. PhotographyEdits (talk) 09:32, 5 August 2024 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 2 August 2024
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Personal Life Section, Legal Issues After 2020 heading, 3rd Paragraph, final sentence grammar update.
Change “On July 27, 2024, Grimes' mother accused Musk for withhold passports of her grandchildren.” to “ On July 27, 2024, Grimes' mother accused Musk of withholding the passports of her grandchildren.” Moirathegoblin (talk) 18:06, 2 August 2024 (UTC)
Done , thanks! Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 19:37, 2 August 2024 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 3 August 2024
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In the Politics subheading of the Other Activities section, should [this story] about Musk forming America PAC and how it is potentially farming swing state voter data be included in the paragraph about his support of Trump's campaign? Coalah (talk) 04:44, 3 August 2024 (UTC)
- The story is covered in the WP article about America PAC so I think it warrants inclusion here, as well. Coalah (talk) 04:47, 3 August 2024 (UTC)
- Added that Musk said he "created" America PAC. QRep2020 (talk) 22:13, 11 August 2024 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 August 2024
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He is of Canadian and maybe Pennsylvania Dutch descent, if the Pennsylvania Dutch were the ones who settled in South Africa. Otherwise he is of Canadian and South African descent. He was able to get a Canadian citizenship via his mother. He couldn't have done that if she was British. Please do not insult Canada by implying that we are British, we are not. We may have started from British settlers but so did America. Would you call someone of American descent British, too? Canada has been an independent country for more almost 160 years, please remember from now on that we are a separate country from England and the UK. I really like the UK, but to call us British is just as bad as calling us American, or calling Austrians, German. Theshowmecanuck (talk) 00:16, 18 August 2024 (UTC)
Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. M.Bitton (talk) 01:44, 18 August 2024 (UTC)
Main Image
editCurrently, the main image in the infobox is an image from 2023. However, a more recent image taken by me of Musk at a conference in Montana last March may be better as it is more recent. I would like to know what you all think Wcamp9 (talk) 03:29, 19 August 2024 (UTC)
