Question and Answer Series:

Kung Fu Against Other Styles

By Grandmaster Wong Kiew Kit

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Question 1

In the formative years of kungfu at the Shaolin temple, were any patterns
learned from visiting martial artists, or did Shaolin kungfu develop
completely independently from other martial arts?

- Sifu Charles Chalmers

Answer
Shaolin Kungfu was (and still is) not only a source but also a receptacle for
many other martial arts. While it provided inspiration and material for other
arts, it also received their best from them. This process of giving to and taking
from other martial arts have continued from its formative years to the
present time.

The first source of Shaolin Kungfu was the Eighteen Lohan Hands, taught by
Bodhidharma, from which the Eighteen Lohan Fist, the prototype of Shaolin
Kungfu, developed. The Eightten Lohan Hands probably came form yoga
exercises practiced by Bodhidharma in India.

Generals who retired to the Shaolin Temple for spiritual cultivation brought
with them their martial arts, which greatly enriched Shaolin Kungfu. They
introduced many classical weapons as well as military strategies to Shaolin.
These generals might also have introduced the Horse-Riding Stance.

From Taoist masters Shaolin Kungfu learned the Small Universe and the Big
Universe. While these two excellent chi kung exercises never became the
principle training methods in the Shaolin Temple, many Shaolin masters
practiced and valued them highly.

The Mongolians brought their famous wrestling, which greatly enriched

Shaolin felling techniques and floor work.

Influences from other martial arts are not necessarily always beneficial.
Karate, which owed much of its material to the Shaolin source, revived free
sparring in Shaolin Kungfu at a time when it was at its worst decay.

Taekwondo, which also owed much of its material to Shaolin, brought in high
kicks. Its influence, especially after Bruce Lee had made kungfu well known
in the West, became so pervasive that for a time many people consider how
good a persons’s kungfu was by how high he could kick!

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The influence of Western Boxing Siamese Boxing is wide-spread. Today, when
they spar, most Shaolin practitioners, indeed most martial artists of any style,
would bounce about and punch and kick like Western and Siamese Boxers.
The influence is so complete that nowadays when one mentions “san da”, the
image is that of kungfu practitioners with boxing gloves fighting like Boxers
in a boxing ring, forgetting that the term actually means free sparring using
typical kungfu forms.

This giving-to and taking-from process of Shaolin Kungfu is interestingly

manifested in our school in relation to Taijiquan. Taijiquan originated from
Shaolin Kungfu. In our school, Taijiquan was first taught to our students to
meet expedient needs modelling on the Shaolin syllabus. In return, Shaolin
Kungfu in our school has benefited much form Taijiquan, like graceful
continuous movement, the flow method of internal force development, and
the integration of form, energy and mind.

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Question 2

If a student shows interest in competing in MMA events, how much should

their instructor encourage them? What benefits would there be from training
for such a competition? What negatives would there be?

- Sifu Matt Fenton

Answer

The instructor should give the student full encouragement and help.

An important aim of our school is to restore the glory of kungfu. An

important manifestation of this aim is to take part in free sparring
competitions using kungfu skills and techniques, and win. We claim that our
kungfu is capable of combat, and we must walk our talk.

But we are not going to let our students enter competitions blindly and be
bashed. As scholar-warriors, we do not enter combat and then hope to win.
We already have won, and enter combat to confirm victory.

We do so not out of vain-glory, but paradoxically out of humbleness. When

we win we must not humiliate our opponents, as unfortunately some MMA
artists do. We must give respect to our opponents due to them. This does not
mean we may not hurt our opponents. If it is absolutely necessary, we will
not hesitate to disable or even kill an opponent. Fortunately, unlike in real
fights, it is not necessary in competitions.

There are many benefits derived from both the training and the actual
participation of MMA and other free sparring competitions.There are, of
course, also negatives. But as scholar-warriors, we shall make the negatives
as opportunities for improvement.

An obvious benefit is to restore the glory of kungfu. We are true to our belief
that our kungfu is combat effective, and are ready to prove it. We do not want
to be made a mockery of our philosophy.

We also have no illusion that MMA artists and other free sparring
competitors are formidable. Except for experienced fighters in our school,
many of our students will be badly beaten if they enter free sparring
competitions now. This is not because our kungfu is inadequate, but because
they lack real fighting skills and experience, which are different from
friendly sparring amongst schoolmates.

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Thus, if our students enter sparring competitions now, not only they will be
defeated but more significantly they will be injured, physically as well as
emotionally. They will lose confidence in themselves as well as in our school,
and have doubts as to what we claim is true.

But we shall change these negatives to opportunities for improvement. We

shall train them systematically so that they will progress from a position of
being defeated and injured to a position where they can win free sparring
competitions honourably and without sustaining injuries themselves. Besides
seeing this transformation and gaining a lot of confidence, they will also gain
much in tactics and strategies, as well as developing internal force and
mental clarity, which are not only useful in free sparring competitions but
more important in their daily lives.

The Choy-Li-Fatt course and the Kungfu against Other Martial Arts course at
the Winter Camp in January 2012 are excellent for this purpose. If all other
things were equal, Choy-Li-Fatt is the most effective for free sparring
competitions, with or without gloves.

The Kungfu against Other Martial Arts course provides the most effective
fighting skills for handling other martial artists. It represents the
crystallization of my more than 20 years of sparring and actual fighting
experience.

Earlier I mentioned that our students should win free sparring competitions
without sustaining injuries. Many people, including our students, may be
very surprised at this statement. It is because they equate free sparring to
generous exchanges of blows and kicks where injuries are inevitable. This is
random hurting one another, not genuine self-defence. In genuine
self-defence, we do not want to be hit, not even once. Such skills will be
systematically taught at the Kungfu against Other Martial Arts course.

Even after taking these two courses at the Winter Camp, students should not
enter free sparring competitions yet. They should apply their fighting skills in
a 30-Opponent programme. This is a close-door secret in our school that
students have to learn personally from their sifus.

After completing the 30-Opponent programme, students should still not enter
MMA competitions yet. MMA competitions represent high-level fighting.
Students should start modestly, taking part first in local, regional and
national competitions to gain experience and confidence before entering
MMA and international competitions. Even in relatively low-level
competitions, we must be sure of winning before we enter the competitions.
A scholar-warrior does not enter combat and hopes to win, he has already
won and enter combat to confirm victory.

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Question 3

Are some styles of Kung Fu more suited than others to fighting with Boxers?
If so, which ones and why.

- Kevin, Shaolin Wahnam Ireland

Answer

Yes, if all other things were equal, Choy-Li-Fatt is most suited than other styles
to fighting with Boxers. It is because Choy-Li-Fatt techniques and footwork
are excellent in overcoming Boxing techniques and bouncing about.

As most martial artists today fight like Boxers regardless of what styles they
practice, Choy-Li-Fatt is an excellent choice if one wishes to be combat
efficient. He must, of course, learn from a competent teacher. Unfortunately,
most kungfu teachers today either only teach solo practice for demonstration
or fighting like Boxers.

We shall have a better idea why Choy-Li-Fatt is more suited to fighting Boxers
than other kungfu styles if we examine some examples of how different
kungfu styles typically respond to Boxers’ attack and defence.

When a Boxer jabs, a typical response from a Shaolin practitioner is to ward

off with a Single Tiger. Even before the Shaolin practitioner can make
contact, the Boxer would have pulled back his first jab, and thrusts another
jab. If the Shaolin practitioner attempts to ward off the second jab with a
second Single Tiger, the Boxer would have thrown a right cross, followed by a
rain of punches on the helpless Shaolin practitioners. The shifting from one
False-Leg Stance to another, or from a False-Leg Stance to a Bow-arrow
Stance by the Shaolin practitioner is also too slow for the bouncing of the
Boxer.

On the other hand, the Shaolin practitioner using typical Shaolin strikes
would have difficulty attacking a Boxer. If he attempts to strike a Boxer using
“Black Tiger Steals Heart”, the Boxer would just parry away his punch with
one hand, and hit his exposed head with the other hand. When the Shaolin
practitioner tries to withdraw into a False-Leg Stance to avoid the Boxer’s
strike, the Boxer would bounce in with a rain of hits on the Shaolin
practitioner.

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The scenario with a Taijiquan practitioner is similar. As a Boxer throws a jab,
a Taijiquan practitioner would typically respond with warding off, using
“Immortal Waves Sleeves”. The Boxer would withdraw his first jab, and
throws a second jab, against which the Taijiquan practitioner would try to
ward off with another “Immortal Waves Sleeves”. The Bower would follow
up with a rain of hits on the helpless Taijiquan practitioner.

Similarly, using typical Taijiquan patterns, a Taijiquan practitioner would

have difficulty attacking a Boxer. If the Taijiquan practitioner attacks with
typical Taijiquan palm strikes and finger-thrusts, the Boxer would just parry
them away, followed by crosses, hooks or undercuts, which a Taijiquan
practitioner may not be accustomed to.

Indeed, these are the main reasons why many kungfu practitioners could not
match Boxers, and also why they discard their kungfu techniques and fight
like Boxers.

Does this mean that kungfu is no match for Boxing? Unfortunately, the
answer is yes – for most kungfu practitioners today. Otherwise they would
not perform kungfu only in solo demonstration, but discard it when sparring
and adopt Boxing techniques.

But for those who have a wide understanding of kungfu philosophy, skills and
techniques, the answer is no. They will choose those skills and techniques
that are most suited to overcome Boxers. This is what we are going to do at
the “Kungfu against Other Styles” course during the 2012 Winter Camp.

The big problem for most kungfu practitioners is that there are so many skills
and techniques to choose from, and they do not know what to choose. In fact
many of them do not even know the difference between skills and
techniques. The problem is further aggravated by the fact that typical kungfu
patterns which they normally practice are not suited to fighting Boxers.

The situation with Choy-Li-Fatt is different. Typical Choy-Li-Fatt patterns are

suited to fighting Boxers and other martial artists! This means that
Choy-Li-Fatt practitioners do not need to choose from hundreds of techniques
those techniques that are most suitable; they just use their typical techniques!

But they still need combat skills and need how to use the techniques for
combat. If they don’t, if they only perform the techniques for solo
demonstration, they will still be bashed by Boxers and other martial artists.
Acquiring the skills and learning how to apply the techniques for combat are
what we shall do at the Choy-Li-Fatt course during the 2012 Winter Camp in
Norway.

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Meanwhile, let us examine how a Choy-Li-Fatt practitioner would typically
respond to a Boxer’s attack. Please bear in mind that while knowing the
philosophy (as explained below) is the first important step, one must practice
and practice to be able to apply the response effectively.

Instead of warding off a Boxer’s jabs as in Shaolin Kungfu and Taijiquan, a

Choy-Li-Fatt practitioner would strike his arm against the Boxer’s jabbing
arms. Would the Choy-Li-Fatt practitioner be hit by the Boxer’s jabs if he does
not defend against the jabs? No, he won’t; his body-movement and footwork
would have avoided the Boxer’s jabs while he simultaneously strike the
Boxer’s arms.

If the Boxer attempts to move forward to rain blows on the Choy-Li-Fatt

practitioner, the Choy-Li-Fatt practitioner would retreat a step and
simultaneously rain blows on the Boxer’s arms or body. If the Boxer tries to
bounce away, the Choy-Li-Fatt practitioner would move in swiftly to rain
blows on him.

The interesting point is that the same technique can be used for attack or
defence. Indeed, the attack and defence run together harmoniously.

The two arms of the Choy-Li-Fatt practitioner are like two iron rods. If an
opponent attacks, he uses his rods to strike the attacking arms. If the
opponent retreats, he uses his rods to strike the opponent’s arms or body.

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Question 4

In the film “Ip Man 2” a fight between a boxer named Twister and Ip Man is a
very closely contested affair. Did the film makers portray a plausible
scenario? By this I mean, could the combat efficiency of a skilled boxer nearly
equal that of a very highly skilled Wing Choon Kung Fu master such as Ip
Man?

- Kevin, Shaolin Wahnam Ireland

Answer

My opinion is that the scenario portrayed in the film was not plausible. In the
film Ip Man successfully fought through an ambush of many armed assailants
out to take his life. Not only he saved himself, he also saved his student who
was far less skillful. With this level of skills, Ip Man in the film could easily
beat the boxer.

There is no doubt that a top boxer is very formidable fighter fighting within
his Boxing rules. However, if there are no rules as in a real fight, a skilled
boxer would be no match against a highly skilled Wing Choon master or a
master of any kungfu style.

Even if Boxing rules were followed, which would place kungfu masters in a
huge handicap, they could beat skilled Boxers readily. Indeed, this actually
happened in China in the early 1900s when kungfu masters like Huo Yun Jia
and Wang Zi Ping convincingly beat foreign Boxers by a huge margin.

There simply is a huge gap in combat potentials between kungfu, which is a

life-death fighting art, and Boxing, which is a sport protected by many safety
rules. A boxer’s techniques are severely limited only to strikes to the body
and parrying with the hands, whereas a kungfu practitioner has a range of
techniques that boxers may not even imagine to be possible.

Even if a kungfu practitioner has to put on gloves and follow Boxing rules, he
still has a bigger range of attack and defence techniques than a boxer by a
huge margin. Hence, it is a blantant excuse to the initiated when some
kungfu practitioners say that they could not fight if they put on gloves.

The fact is that even without the boxing gloves these kungfu practitioners
could not fight because their training is only on solo demonstration and
never on combat. If they have had kungfu combat training, they would be

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able to fight even when putting on boxing gloves would have much reduced
their fighting potential.

Choy-Li-Fatt Kungfu is particularly effective in this respect. If all other factors

were equal, a Choy-Li-Fatt practitioner would be more combat efficient than
practitioners of all other martial arts – with or without gloves. This is because
of the wide range of Choy-Li-Fatt techniques for boxing-style fighting.

In other words, if both combatants have equal force, speed and fighting
experience, the one using Choy-Li-Fatt techniques would have a bigger
advantage in winning than the other using any other martial art! If the
Choy-Li-Fatt practitioner loses the combat, it is not because of his techniques
or boxing gloves he has to wear, but because of his speed, force, fighting
experience or other factors.

One of the main objectives of the Choy-Li-Fatt course in the Winter Camp of
January 2012 is to realize this special feature of Choy-Li-Fatt in combat – with
or without gloves, and with or without abiding by Boxing rules.

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Question 5

What are the most crucial elements that distinguish Chinese kungfu from all
other fighting arts?

- Sifu Zhang Wuji

Answer

If I am to pick the most crucial element that distinguishes Chinese kungfu

from most other fighting arts, I would choose internal force. It separates
Chinese kungfu from all other martial arts.

Because Chinese kungfu focuses on internal force, whereas other martial arts
don’t, it results in many manifestations. For example, due to internal force,
age, gender and size are not crucial in Chinese kungfu, but this is not the case
in other martial arts. An elderly, fragile-looking lady can be more powerful
and more combat efficient than a young, muscular man, whereas in other
martial arts an older person is normally stronger than a younger person, a
man normally stronger than a woman, and one with big muscles normally
stronger than one who is smaller sized.

Because of internal force, Chinese kungfu training contributes to health,

vitality and longevity, whereas other martial arts do not! This may come as a
surprise to many people, and some may be angry at the statement, but it is to
their benefit to know the truth.

The truth is that other martial arts may contribute to the practitioners’
combat efficiency and physical fitness, but not to their health, vitality and
longevity. This does not mean that those who practice other martial arts
cannot be healthy, have vitality and enjoy longevity. They can, but it is due to
other reasons, and not due to their martial art training. On the other hand,
even leaving aside other reasons, just by practicing Chinese kungfu alone
contributes to the practitioners’ health, vitality and longevity.

Why is this so? It is because of internal force training in Chinese kungfu,

which involves energy flow, whereas in other martial arts the training is
physical which involves muscular tension and metal stress.

In other martial arts, energy is spent during training, resulting in

practitioners having less energy after the training than before. As good
health, vitality and longevity depends on the amount and smoothness of

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energy flow, a reduction of energy due to physical training detracts from
good health, vitality and longevity. On the other hand, in kungfu training,
energy flow is generated, resulting in practitioners having an increase in both
volume and smoothness of energy flow after the training than before. This
contributes to good health, vitality and longevity.

In internal force training, practitioners need to be physically and mentally

relaxed. This further enhances their energy flow, resulting in better health,
vitality and longevity. In other martial art training, which is physical,
practitioners tense their muscles so as to generate physical strength, which
also results in mental stress. This causes energy blockage which further
distract from health, vitality and longevity.

Internal force training is actually found in all styles of kungfu, though it is not
obvious in so-called external styles! It is taught right at the start of all kungfu
styles – in the form of stance training. It lays the foundation of kungfu, which
is not just strengthening practitioners’ legs as many students erroneously
believe, but a training of energy and mind.

In their practice, kungfu practitioners of all styles are to be physically and

mentally relaxed. It is only when they are relaxed, can they explode internal
force, or “fatt keng” in Cantonese, “fa jin” in Mandrin pronunciation. I
remember that when I was small I heard and read stories of masters of
so-called external styles, like Wing Choon and Prahying Mantis, exploding
internal force when fighting. Leong Chan, a famous Wing Choon master who
was slender and elegant, for example, could fell an able-bodied opponent
with just a single palm strike.

However, genuine kungfu with internal force training is now very rare. Many
kungfu students today not only bounce about like Boxers but also adopt
physical training of other martial arts like weight lifting and rope skipping. It
is like throwing away gems for stones.

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Question 6

Would Shaolin masters of the past like Uncle Righteousness , Grandmaster Ho

Fatt Nam , The Ten Tigers of Canton , Pak Mei , and Bodhidharma compare to
masters in the modern day when it comes to combat efficiency and internal
force.

- Steve Rivera, Shaolin Wahnam USA

Answer

Modern day masters are nowhere in combat efficiency compared to masters

in the past not only in Shaolin but also in any kungfu styles.Past masters
could kill with just one strike, whereas modern day masters freely exchange
blows in combat.

Past masters could walk down a street and be ambushed by more than 30
armed assailants yet emerged unhurt. As recent as 60 years ago, my sifu, Sifu
Ho Fatt Nam, single-handedly fought off more than 30 armed assailants who
intended to kill his family and burn his house, and of course he and his
family remained unhurt. Today many modern day kungfu masters cannot
even fight against a good Boxer or a Karate blackbelt.

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Question 7

Which skills should a kungfu student develop to beat a highly skilled boxer?
How to develop these skills? Which strategies would you recommend to apply
in fighting Boxers?

- Sifu Anton Schmich, Shaolin Wahnam Germany

Answer

Some important skills a kungfu student should develop if he wishes to beat a

highly skilled Boxer are as follows:

1. Being relaxed and focused

2. Ability to correctly judge a Boxer’s reach
3. Good stance and body-movement to avoid a Boxer’s strikes
4. Good footwork to chase after a Boxer’s retreat
5. Adequate coverage to prevent a Boxer’s surprise counters

Some people may be surprised at the above answers. This is probably due to
their confusing skills with techniques.

These skills may be developed in the following ways:

1. Practice appropriate chi kung exercises to be relaxed and focused
2. Practice systematically with a sparring partner using appropriate
techniques to develop good spacing and timing as well as
body-movement
3. Systematically practice chasing a Boxer as he retreats taking care to
cover him adequately, then defeating him decisively
4. Practice sparring with Boxers, progressing progressively from low-level
Boxers to high-level Boxers

The following strategies are invaluable:

1. Do not hand your defeat to a Boxer
2. Exploit his offers
3. Create victory if he does not hand out his defeat

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The following tactics with the appropriate skills are useful:
1. Cover and strike
2. Cover, chase and strike
3. Cover, fell and strike
4. Continuous kicks
5. Cover and chin-na

Techniques that are useful in implementing the above strategies and tactics
include the following. The pattern names are in Shaolin terms; Taijiquan
practitioners may use the Taijiquan equivalents.
1. Bow-Arrow Thread Bridge
2. Single Tiger Emerges from Cave
3. Wave Dragon Back to Cave
4. Golden Leopard Speeds through Forest
5. Fell Tree with Roots
6. White Crane Steps on Snow
7. White Ape Holds Branch
8. Double Bows Tame Tiger
9. Happy Bird Hops up Branch

All these strategies, tactics and techniques will be taught at the “Kungfu
against Other Styles” course in the Winter Camp in Janaury 2012 in Norway.

Fighting against Boxers is also an important topic in the “Choy-Li-Fatt”

course, where two other strategies and typical Choy-Li-Fatt techniques will be
used.

The two strategies are:

1. If there is form, strike the form
2. If there is no form, strike the shadow

Answering an earlier question I said that for most kungfu practitioners today,
kungfu would not be able to match Boxing. This is because there are so many
techniques in kungfu that these practitioners do not know the most suitable
techniques for this purpose, so they use typical kungfu techniques which are
generally not suitable for fighting against Boxing. More significantly, they do
not have systematic combat training.

However, if we choose the most suitable techniques and skills as well as

tactics and strategies, we can reverse the situation. Boxers will find it hard to
match well-trained kungfu practitioners.

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During my trip to the United States recently, Anthony Spinicchia brought out
the topic of kungfu classics. I mentioned that even when one had access to
the classics, he might not understand them.One reason was that important
information was merely stated in the classics, but not explained.

The answer here provides a good example.Many people would not

understand what is written above, though the writing is actually simple and
straight-forward. Shaolin Wahnam students may be able to understand half
of it, but those who have attended a kungfu against other martial arts course
will understand clearly.

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Question 8

Which strategies would you recommend to apply in fighting MMA

practitioners?

- Sifu Anton Schmick, Shaolin Wahnam Germany

Answer

A good strategy is to avoid the opponent’s strength and attack his weakness.
MMA practitioners are all-rounders except chin-na and dim-mark. Hence
applying chin-na or dim-mark on them is recommended.

When you can successful apply chin-na or dim-mark on them, irrespective of

their size and physical strength, you can subdue them. The victory is also
elegant and is reversible.

This strategy can be used if you are good at chin-na or dim-mark, and you are
not wearing gloves. Of course, if these two conditions are not present, you
would not be able to use this strategy.

Another useful strategy is to strike the form if there is form, strike the
shadow if there is no form. The advantage is that you can apply this strategy
regardless of whether you wear boxing gloves or not, but your arms need to
be powerful.

When a MMA practitioner attacks you, irrespective of what attack he uses,

you move a step slantingly back and strike your arms on his attacking arms
or body.

If there is insufficient space for you to move back, you can move to his side or
back, in which case you strike a leopard fist into his ribs, spine or back of his
head. If you do not wish to maim him, instead of striking his vital spot, you
can fell him on his back, simultaneously apply a tiger-claw on his throat.

If he moves back, you chase his shadow and strike your powerful arms on his
body or head.

A third useful strategy is to strike him when he is not prepared for it. When
he is taking you down, for example, dislocate his neck using “Naughty
Monkey Plucks Coconut”, or tear off his groin using “Monkey Steals Peaches”.

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This will kill or maim him, which of course we would not want to do. Instead
you can grip hard at his throat, using “Golden Cockerel Locks Throat” or his
groin using the same monkey technique. MMA practitioners are not used to
the concept of control. Hence, you must hurt him enough for him to let go of
his attack, but not serious enough to kill or maim him.

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Question 9
There are several stories of classical kung fu masters and even modern
masters "mixing" together various styles and sets to create combinations.
Examples that I can think of are the Tiger-Crane set of Hoong Ka, Choy Li
Fatt's three progenitor systems, Dong Hai Chuan's Baguazhang students (who
were already accomplished in other arts) and even your own experience (if
my memory is correct) in adding certain hand forms to the One Finger
Shooting Zen set.

How can a master be sure that any modifications that he makes to a

particular form do not dilute or otherwise distract from the advantages that
are already there in the original forms?

- Frederick Chu

Answer

A master is sure from his understanding and experience. If he is not sure, he

may dilute or distract from the advantages already present in the original
forms. Worse, he may cause harmful effects.

Let us take two examples.

Hoong Hei Khoon was a master of the tiger form. He understood the form
well, and had much experience in using the forms effectively.

His wife, Fong Wing Choon, was a master of the crane form. From his wife,
Hoong Hei Khoon learned the crane form, which he also had much
understanding and experience.

From his understanding and experience, Hoong Hei Khoon found that while
his tiger form was excellent for combat, there were occasions when he could
further improve his combat efficiency by adding a crane form.

For example, instead of using a thrust kick as in “White Horse Presents Hoof”
which was found in his tiger form, he could use an organ-seeking kick as in
“White Crane flaps Wings” which needed less effort, was less conspicuous,
and more deadly.

So he included some crane patterns into his tiger form, resulting in the
famous Tiger-Crane Set. He fully understood what he was doing, and realized
the pro and con of adding crane patterns to his tiger form. He also had much

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experience of the resulting benefits.

Now let us take an example of a modern kungfu master. Although he is called

a master out of respect, he has no understanding and no experience of using
his kungfu form to develop internal force or for combat.

When he sees other martial artists using weights and kick-boxers sparring, he
is impressed. So he incorporates into his school weight lifting as a force
training method and kick-boxing for sparring purposes. He may even call his
art kungfu-do.

He does not have a deep understanding of weight-lifting and kick-boxing. For

example, he does not understanding that developing big muscles in
weight-lifting causes energy blockage, and that free exchange of blows in
kick-boxing causes him internal injuries.

He also has no experience of weight-lifting and kick-boxing enriching his

kungfu. He has a mistaken concept that big muscles and kick-boxing improve
his combat efficiency, not knowing his combat efficiency would be much
better had he known how to apply kungfu for combat, and also not realizing
that weight-lifting and kick-boxing have brought him harmful effects.

Hence, by mixing weight-lifting and kick-boxing with kungfu, this modern

master has diluted and distracted from his original kungfu form, and has
actually brought harmful effects to himself and his students. Such harmful
attempts to create combinations without proper understanding and
experience, unfortunately, are not uncommon nowadays.

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Question 10

Your courses like Shaolin against other Martial Arts get more and more
amazing though they cover many basic techniques! It is simply mind blowing
that whenever I think “Oh yes I know that”. it turns out to be a big surprise.

Why is that I keep on being amazed, amused and blown away even when
taking so called basic courses?

- Sifu Roland Mastel

Answer

The main reason is that I keep improving both the contents and skills of my
teaching. Another reason is that these new courses are devised to meet
expedient needs. The third reason is that due to my wide understanding and
experience, I am able to choose the most suitable material and teach it in a
most effective way for the purpose in question.

For example, there is at present an expedient need for students to handle

Boxing and Kick-Boxing because irrespective of what martial arts they
practice, most martial artists today spar like Boxers and Kick-Boxers. Hence, I
have devised two new courses, Shaolin and Taijiquan against other martial
arts.

Both the techniques and skills in these two new courses are very basic. In
fact, they are of a lower level than the techniques and skills taught in the
basic Shaolin 16 combat sequences and the Taijiquan 12 combat sequences.

However, because of my wide understanding and experience in combat

application, I know that what students need are not advanced skills and
techniques, but confidence and experience in meeting opponents who use a
fighting art very different from what they have been accustomed to. In fact, if
the skills and techniques are too sophisticated, they may become a hindrance
instead of an aid. Therefore I choose more simple skills and techniques,
which are more effective.

I also teach these skills and techniques systematically and progressively,

paying more attention to skills than to techniques, as it is actually skills that
students need when fighting against Boxers and Kick-Boxers. As the
techniques used by Boxers and Kick-Boxers are simple, relatively simple
kungfu techniques are sufficient to handle them if our students have good
skills. Indeed, sophisticated techniques would slow down the acquiring of

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these skills.

Although the skills and techniques are simple, there is much profundity in
their application. For example, a small difference between using “Bow-Arrow
Thread Bridge” for blocking or for threading can bring a big difference in
result. If you use it for blocking, as many initiated practitioners would do, you
expose yourself to a Boxer’s punches. If you use it for threading, you hit a
Boxer as he launches forward to strike you.

The teaching is systematic. First, students learn to keep a Boxer at bay. Next,
they deflects, not blocks, his strikes. Then they cover him adequately. Only
when students have ensured they are safe, they counter-attack the Boxer.

The teaching is also progressive. First, students practice at low speed and
with little force. Next, they practice at normal speed and with normal force.
Then they practice at high speed and with much force. In their
counter-attack, the progress gradually from striking to felling, to chin-na and
to kicking. With systematic and progressive training, students can benefit in
an hour what others may not obtain in many months of random and
haphazard premature free sparring.

So, although you are an advanced practitioner, you may still be amazed,
amused and blown away by such a basic course. You are amazed, for
example, by the effectiveness of the systematic and progressive teaching
methodology; you are amused by the fact that such simple skills and
techniques can produce better results than sophisticated skills and
techniques, and you are blown away by the transformation of students in
such a short time from a position of uncertainty and nervousness to a
position of confidence and efficiency when facing Boxers and Kick-Boxers.

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Question 11

With regards to lifting weights to train internal force, as well as just about
any other activity, how does chi relate to the muscles? I know that large
muscles can take a lot of energy to maintain, and that tense muscles can lock
up chi. However, my western mindset tells me that muscles are a necessary
part of moving. Is it possible to move without muscles? Does practicing
Shaolin Kungfu cause one's body to have the optimal amount of muscle, not
too much and not too little? Am I causing myself confusion by combining two
different paradigms?

- Sifu Matt Fenton

Answer

You have raised a very interesting point regarding internal force and the use
of muscles. I believe no one has explained this point before. I have not read
anything about it in classics or modern writing. My answer, therefore, is
probably unprecedented. It is based on my experience as well as my
understanding of force training philosophy.

When we say, “Don’t use your muscles” we are speaking provisionally. What
we mean is that we do not tense our muscles. In the same way, when we say
that a person’s energy is blocked, we mean that it is relatively blocked. There
is still some energy flowing.

You are right – muscles are necessary for movement. Even when we use
internal force, muscles are involved. One cannot move without muscles. But
we do not tense our muscles in the way when external martial artists use
muscular strength.

But this does not mean that the muscles are listless. The muscles are also taut,
but we do not use the term “tensed” as it may give a wrong connotation. The
muscles are taut, without being tensed, because they are charged with
flowing energy.

Herein lies the big difference. When one tenses his muscles, they become taut
because energy is locked up in the muscles. Moving the muscular mass with
speed provides muscular strength.

When we use internal force, we relax our muscles and let energy flow
through them. The muscles also become taut, not because of tension but
because they are charged with energy. The flowing energy provides internal

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force.

The concept may become clearer if we use an analogy. An empty water hose
is listless. It becomes taut when we fill it with pieces of solid ice. This
corresponds to muscular strength.

The water hose can also become taut when we fill it with flowing water. This
corresponds to internal force.

The solid ice in the water hose is “dead”. Its use is limited to making the
water hose taut to produce mechanical strength. After some time it becomes
stale.

The flowing water in the water hose is “alive”. Its use is holistic. Besides
making the water hose taut to produce internal force, it can also be used for
many other purposes wherever it flows to. It is always fresh and constantly
re-charged.

Yes, practicing Shaolin Kungfu or Taijiquan can result in the optimal amount
of muscles. You are not causing confusion. In fact your questions open a new
vantage point concerning muscles, mechanical strength, energy flow and
internal force. It is questions like yours that enable us to understand our arts
more deeply, helping us to obtain better result in less time.

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Question 12

Sifu, When Buddhism and Kung Fu mingled it was the same in essence as the
traveling yogis of India and Himalaya. And living conditions linked the
student and teacher to a very close connection so that direct transmission
and teaching was guiding the student every step of the way.

Today modern society and life style makes a different challenge for living in
such persistent practice. The Shaolin Temple seems to have changed for
tourist interests, though Wudang Mountain appears to maintain their roots.
(But I don’t really know anything about Shaolin or Wudang, I just look this up
on internet and make my own assumptions.) During the Cultural Revolution
many masters fled to Asia and Indonesia. Are there still teachers and places
for students to go to in order to find this kind of close training?

- Spencermk

Answer

I don’t know of any place today where students and teachers stay together for
life like in the Shaolin Temple or on Wudang Mountain in the past to practice
kungfu and spiritual cultivation. This does not mean there are no such places
today, but I do not know of such places and I don’t think there are.

The closest I knew of was Dr Yang Jwing Ming’s noble project of getting
dedicated students to stay with him in a retreat for 10 years to practice and
revive the greatness of kungfu. I did not follow this project and therefore do
not know of its progress.

Years ago I was offered a place on a scenic mountain as well as fund to build
something like the Shaolin Temple to teach chi kung and Shaolin Kungfu.
(This was even before I taught Taijiquan publicly, so the question of teaching
Taijiquan in this retreat centre did not arise.) I declined this kind offer
because I was not ready to dedicate myself to this secluded task. I preferred,
and still prefer, travelling around the world teaching deserving students
besides enjoying delicious food and seeing beautiful places with my dedicated
students.

Later, Sifu Rama Roberto built a retreat centre on the Blue Mountain in Costa
Rica. At first he wanted to call it the Shaolin Temple, but after discussion with
me, he decided to call it Shaolin Wahnam Centre instead because he didn’t
intend to have any real monks there.

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Although the Shaolin Wahnam Centre on the Blue Mountain is founded to
preserve genuine chi kung, Shaolin Kungfu and Taijiquan, it is different from
the Shaolin Temple and the Wudang Temple in the past. Besides not having
monks, which would be a basic requirement for a temple, a crucial difference
is that students and teachers do not stay together for life or for a long time at
the Shaolin Wahnam Centre on the Blue Mountain. Although courses are
conducted there throughout the year, different students attend different
courses at different times for different objectices.

My son, Sifu Wong Chun Nga, also thought of setting up a Shaolin Wahnam
Centre in Malaysia. I was not in favour of the idea for economic
considerations. It would be too costly to upkeep. Although many students
come to Malaysia yearly for my intensive and special courses, it would be
more comfortable for them and much cheaper for me to conduct the courses
in luxurious hotels, even when the money for the hotel accommodation were
paid to maintain the centre.

Besides economic considerations, more important is the difference in aims

and objectives between practitioners at the Shaolin Temple and Wudang
Temple in the past and Shaolin Wahnam practitioners today.

Practitioners at the Shaolin and Wudang temples were monks. They had
renounced all worldly affairs to live a temple life and practice the Shaolin or
Wudang arts to attain Enlightenment.

Shaolin Wahnam practitioners do not want to be monks. They practice the

arts taught in Shaolin Wahnam to make their own lives as well as the lives of
other people more rewarding and meaningful here and now, including
enjoying delicious food, enjoying wholesome sex and happy times with their
friends and family members – legitimate worldly pleasures not permitted to
monks.

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Question 13

How do we end up being warriors?

I consider my own body/mind the most difficult battlefield and I the most
formidable opponent, and to overcome my own weaknesses has been the
purpose of my entire life! But, why Sifu? Why or how do I or am of a
Warrior’s cast? Why do I take so much pride into standing for what I believe
is trustful and honorable? Why do I am willing to spare my life for it?

- Angel

Answer

Different people will answer the same questions differently, and my answers
are as follows.

We can end up being warriors by practicing what warriors do.

We do not want just to be warriors, we want to be scholar-warriors, not in the

literal but in the figurative sense.

In other words we do not want to be professional soldiers, take up arms and

go to wars, while being well versed in the scholar arts like philosophy,
literature, painting and music. Rather we want to have and put in daily
practice typical qualities of top warriors and scholars, like courage, fitness,
determination, integrity, morality, mental clarity and intellectual prowess. In
practical terms we want to excel in both our business and private lives.

Obviously, merely wishing to be a scholar-warrior, or reading about how to

become one, does not make you into a scholar warrior. You become a
scholar-warrior by doing what a typical scholar-warrior does. And to do that
well, you need the qualities of top scholar-warriors.

An excellent way to accomplish this is to practice the philosophy and arts you
have learnt in Shaolin Wahnam. Why? Simply because the philosophy and
arts in Shaolin Wahnam are meant to train students to become
scholar-warriors.

In principle, it is the same as if you want to become a lawyer you practice

what you learn in a good law school; or if you want to be a deep-sea diver you
practice what you learn in a good deep-sea diving school, because these
schools train you to be a lawyer or a deep-sea diver.

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Saying that he himself is his own most formidable opponent has become a
cliché often with the person not really knowing what he means.

In many situations this saying is helpful. Amongst other benefits, it reminds

the person not to give up easily, or to be vain when defeating other
opponents.

But when we examine the saying with some mental clarity, it is often not true
for many people. For many students in Shaolin Wahnam, for example, the
saying is not true.

It is now actually harder for many students to defeat other martial artists in
free sparring competitions than to practice free sparring the way I have been
telling them to, including with an element of threat and undergoing the
30-Opponent programme. The interesting point is that if they put into
practice my advice, not merely listening to it, they will eventually find it easy
to defeat other martial artists in free sparring competitions.

For you too, though the above advice is not meant for you because you have
taken part in and have won many free sparring competitions, your own
body/mind is not your most difficult battlefield and you yourself are not the
most formidable opponent. In my opinion, your body/mind is your easiest
battlefield and you yourself are the easier opponent simply because you have
full control over your body/mind and over yourself.

Still, why do you believe in this saying?As I have mentioned earlier, different
people may give different answers. My answer is that you have been
conditioned to this cliché. Now you can look at it in a new light.

While you should overcome your own weaknesses, it should not be the
purpose of your entire life. There are many other more meaningful and also
more pleasant things to do, like using Wahnam Taijiquan to win international
free sparring competitions and helping people with so-called incurable
diseases to regain good health – noble aims which I believe you have
dedicated yourself to.

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Question 14

Sifu, I understand Wahnam students did enter sparring competitions in the

past in Malaysia, and were very successful. Can you tell us about the
conditions and outcome of the early competitions we entered?

- Sifu Markus Kahila

Answer

Yes, when I taught at the Shaolin Wahnam Association in Sungai Petani,

Malaysia in the 1980s. We did enter free sparring competitions and were very
successful.

I particularly remember an occasion, though I cannot remember the year the

competition was held, where we won all the final places in both the Under-30
and the Veteran divisions.

It was the Kedah Open All-Style Free Sparring Full-Contact Competition.

There were two divisions, Under-30 (if I remember correctly) and Veteran. To
us this classification was an irony because all our best fighters were above 30,
which would put then in the Veteran division, specially created because the
organizers thought that those over 30 would not be as good fighters as those
younger.

Hong Kok Beng won the Under-30 division, while Teoh Cheng Keat was the
runners-up. You might have met Teoh Cheng Keat at one of the wedding
dinners. He was a former Muay Thai instructor before he learned from me.
Now he is a successful businessman driving a Mercedes.

In the Veteran division, Cheng Shang Shou was the champion, while Lim
Swee Beng (if I remember his name correctly) was the runners-up. All the
champions and runners-up were from Shaolin Wahnam.

I did not mention this achievement because we did not pay much importance
to winning competitions. In fact I almost had forgotten about it until you
brought it up. Actually we did not specially train for the competition.
Persuaded by the organizers to take part, we just sent four competitors and
all of them became champions and runners-up in their respective divisions.

Another reason why I did not mention it was because I was not really proud
of the achievement as the number of participants was not as large as what
the organizers made it out to be, though on the night of the finals the hall was

29
fully packed with spectators. When I asked the organizers why there weren’t
a lot of participants taking part in an all-style open competition, he told me,
probably jokingly though it was flattering, that many did not take part when
they knew we were competing!

Irrespective of whether it was a flattering joke, it was inspiring. We would

like to repeat this feat where all the finalists are Shaolin Wahnam
competitors. With strategic planning and systematic training now, this feat is
certainly easier realized than before when we just sent in our competitors
randomly.

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