SOUTHWEST AIRLINES PILOTS ASSOCIATION

The Early Years

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 Southwest Airlines Pilots Association
(SWAPA)
The Early Years
August 6, 2020
Some records show that Southwest Airlines Pilots Association (SWAPA) started in 1978 as the
bargaining group for the Pilots at Southwest Airlines. It was in 1978 that SWAPA was registered
legally with the National Labor Relations Board; however, SWAPA existed and was recognized
before that.
Meetings of the Southwest Airlines Pilots Group
were held almost from the very beginning in 1971.
The first meeting was held in Captain Fred
Deakins’s (#103) home. His son, Fred Deakins
(#82599), is now a Captain with Southwest and
supplied the photo to the right. Subsequent
meetings were held on a regular basis at different
times and places. I was aware of a Crew Council
that was formed. I was not involved early on with
that group but believed it to be formed similar to a
group from the ex-Purdue Airlines Pilots. This
Clockwise: Emilio Salazar (#204), Hal Tietjen (#99), Mary
Crew Council would discuss items of interest with Tidwell (wife of John Tidwell #207), Mary Ann Deakins (wife
Southwest management. The Crew Council of Fred Deakins #103), Jim Everett (#201), John Matter Sr
consisted of volunteers and changed quite often. (#205), Sarah Everett (wife of Jim Everett) and Betty Tietjen
(Wife of Hal Tietjen) Circa 1971
My involvement with the Pilots Group started in
1974 as Assistant. Later I was elected President for the years 1975 and 1976. Most records, official
and personal, from those years have been discarded or lost. I will list as close as I can remember
the events in those years. I will list these events in those years to the best of my recollection.
The Crew Council usually consisted of a President and an Assistant.
These were selected by whoever would volunteer. By 1974 Captain
Jim Everett (#201) was serving as President. I found myself as
Assistant or Vice President. Duties were not well defined. Meetings
were held about every other month. Unfortunately, they were often
little more than disorganized Happy Hours. Someone would bring
beer and drinks. Business was conducted by a show of hands if there
was an item that needed to be discussed. Eventually our Pilot Group
became frustrated and was looking for some organization. Early in
1974 it was decided we needed help. By a show of hands our Pilot
Group voted to contact ALPA. I mentioned it to Captain Everett
Captain Jim Everett (#201)
wondering how we should proceed with that. He believed it was a
bad idea and thought we should not. I decided to contact ALPA on my own and get information
for our group. I talked with lawyers at Braniff, Texas International, and the American Airlines
Pilot Association. Their advice was to organize our group first and then get back with them. Given
our small size and no third pilot on the flight deck, I believe they had little interest in our Pilots
group. I presented my findings to our Pilots group at the next meeting. Given our lack of

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organization, I did not think Southwest management had any idea what our group wanted. Since
we would need to become organized, I suggested we do that first and then try working with
Southwest management. If that did not work, we could then go to ALPA for help. I recommended
giving it at least a year.
I came to this conclusion after sitting in on two meetings with Captain Everett and Captain Don
Ogden (#5). These meetings were more a discussion between Captain Ogden and Captain Everett
on how they thought things should be done. There was no discussion on what the Pilot Group had
decided. I got the impression this was the way the Crew Council had always conducted business.
Although I discussed this with Captain Everett after the meetings, he did not agree with me and
resisted changing.
Our meetings were held on Saturdays.
At the time Southwest did not fly
overnights on Saturdays and we had the
most pilots available for the meetings.
At our April 1974 meeting Captain
Warren Hampton (#100) showed up
with a case of beer. Our meetings had
already tended to be quite disorganized
with many smaller discussions going
on at the same time. Very little business
was accomplished. These meetings
became quite raucous as time went on. Ernie Gabona (#525), Jack Cardwell (#202) and Warren Hampton
Both Captain Everett and I were quite (#100) at SWA Flight Operations circa 1974.
frustrated.
After one particularly inefficient meeting, I sat down on a Sunday afternoon at an old IBM
Selectric® typewriter (seen left) I had bought and started typing a
Constitution for our Pilots Group. I think the frustration had finally
gotten to me. I previously had purchased two books on parliamentary
procedure and used those as a guide to writing it. I completed the
whole document that afternoon. I later presented it to Captain Everett
and suggested we use it to help organize our meetings. Although he
was also frustrated with our Pilots Group, he did not like the idea and
did not think it would help us.
While Captain Everett was President, I remember two accomplishments. Bidding on open time
was completed. Also, monthly line bids were agreed on as long as it was legal from one month to
the next. It was more or less a preference system, but not yet a true bid system. There may have
been other things accomplished, but not of significant recollection.
It was in 1974 that Southwest added HRL and started to hire more pilots. I started flying Captain
trips in June 1974, with a full Captain line of time by October. During that time First Officer
Owen Morrison (#515) was on my jump seat one day and suggested our Pilot Group needed to
become more organized and should set up a Constitution. Since I had a copy of the Constitution, I
had written in my flight bag, I showed it to him. He said, exactly what we need. We did not yet
know how to adopt it, but knew with the hiring, our pilot group would be changing.

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During a meeting, which I believe was in September 1974, Captain Everett announced he was
resigning as President. I also said I was resigning as Vice President. At that point we had no one
in charge. Captain Roger Benjamin (#107) asked if I would serve as President. I said I would. As
it turned out, I became the last officer to volunteer for our Pilots Group. After that all officers were
elected by ballot. I set up the next meeting in November 1974. I planned to set a vote on the
Constitution I had written. Copies were provided beforehand. If agreed on and passed, elections
would be held for officers.

At the November 1974 meeting the Constitution

was passed as written and elections were held. I
was elected President, Owen Morrison (#515) as
Assistant (VP), and Sam Cohn (#213) as
Secretary/Treasurer. The SWAPA record shows a
coversheet with 1973 and a logo. This is not
original but was added later. The logo was not part
of the original Constitution. The original title of
“Southwest Airlines Pilots Association” is
accurate. American’s “Allied Pilots Association”
was used as an example. In time our Pilots group
became known as SWAPA. Our officer terms were Gene Van Overschelde (#212) Sam Cohn (#213)

then set at two years starting in January 1975 and ending in January 1977. Assistant was set for
two opposite years and would later become known as Vice President.
The year 1974 was probably the most significant year in establishing SWAPA as an independent
union. One of the first actions I attempted was to establish a true bid system. I met with Captain
Ogden about this and convinced him it could be done using the system I recommended which
included using priority open time to make up for lost trips on the monthly overlap. I wanted him
to try it. After an hour and several puffs on his pipe, he would not budge. I was totally discouraged.
The next day he called me into his office. Overnight he had changed his mind and decided to work
with us on setting up a true monthly bid system using priority open time. It worked and we never
went back.

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Our Pilot meetings were still a challenge. I set up a no drinking during meetings rule. Happy
Hour would be after the meeting. During my term as President all meetings were held at the La
Quinta on Regal Row near where Southwest Headquarters were. It took about three meetings and
some very stern warnings, but pilots started accepting our Constitution to conduct the meetings.
After that our meetings became very good and meaningful. We also started keeping very good
records including accurate notebooks of the meetings. One of the most significant meetings with
Captain Ogden was on setting up a method for military leave. At all meetings, I always addressed
what the pilots had decided and never my opinion. Captain Ogden asked how many pilots were at
the meeting. I believe he wanted to make sure I was representing a significant percentage of the
Pilots. I pulled out my notebook and gave him the exact number. It was over 90% with most of the
missing pilots on overnights. That was probably the most significant meeting I had with him. He
realized we were organized as a group. After that he became our ally and tried very hard to
understand our needs and work with us. SWAPA had become considered by Southwest
management the representative of the Pilots. Captain Ogden said he would rather work with us
than some other union like ALPA.
Other meetings involved pay and working with Southwest President Lamar Muse. See the attached
memo dated 1975. These meetings would occur each year near the anniversary of Southwest in
June and were regularly a challenge and sometimes rather contentious, we did present proposals.
During my two-year term, I had two such meetings. Our proposals were usually very reasonable.
He would give us a bit more than we asked for and then did not understand why we were
dissatisfied. The biggest issue we had was loss of seniority when upgrading to Captain. There
were several in those meetings including volunteers and committees who had helped with setting
up the proposals. Muse told us never to bring up the seniority issue again. We did anyway at every
meeting, but to no avail. Since Pilots were upgrading fairly rapidly, it did not become a big issue
at first. Muse presented an attitude of his way or the highway with us. He would use the same
method with the Southwest Board of Directors. Muse subsequently left Southwest. The seniority
issue was resolved after he left.
The first records of SWAPA, that I am aware of, were the notebooks we kept. Keeping records
was a bit more difficult back then. Southwest did let us use their copy machine on a limited basis
when it was not jammed. I also used carbon paper in my typewriter. I marvel at what is available
now and taken for granted. Most of these records were lost or discarded. Looking back at the
success of Southwest, these records would have been quite informative and of great historical
value.
Although a number of things were accomplished during my term as President of SWAPA, I do not
remember all of them. I had a lot of volunteers on committees that helped. Credit should be given
to all the Pilots who contributed their time and effort to help establish SWAPA as its own union
and eventually became registered in 1978. After my term and beginning in January 1977, Captain
Sam Cohn was elected President. I know Captain Ogden urged him to become established with

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the state as a registered legal union to keep SWAPA as the official representative for the Pilots.
That was accomplished in 1978 while Captain Cohn was President.
Early in 1977 after my term as President was over, I received a call from someone at ALPA. They
were now interested in helping us join ALPA. I told them we were actually doing very well dealing
directly with Southwest management but, would let them know if we ever needed their help. Has
not happened yet. The goals of making Southwest great were the same for both the Pilots and
management. I believe that was an asset for both.
Captain Ogden asked me to become Check Airman in early 1977. Since then I was more closely
involved with management, but still a member of SWAPA.
Fraternally,
Eugene “Gene” Van Overschelde (#212)
Captain (retired), Southwest Airlines

Editors’ note: SWAPA has grown to representing nearly 10,000 Pilots. Among the many
committees within SWAPA, a relatively new one inside the organization is called SWAPA Family,
which helps the families of SWAPA members better understand the challenges of the airline
industry. The list of Presidents of SWAPA over the years is as follows:

SWAPA President Name - Last, First MI. (Alt) Emp No

1974 Everett, James R. (Jim) 201
Van Overschelde, Eugene L.
1975-1976 212
(Gene)
1977-1978 Cohn, Samuel E. (Sam) 213
1979-1980 Palmason, Stephen T. (Steve) 992
1981-1982 Killen, David A. (Dave) 739
1983-1984 Egan, Michael J. (Mike) 1049
1985-1986 Bradley, Gerald H. (Jerry) 1677
1987-1990 Schnobrich, John R. 1000
1991-1992 Brumbaugh, Don F. 1808
1993-1996 Kerans, Gary L. 2299
1997-2000 Kramer, John E. 5175
2001-2002 Weaks, Jonathan L. (Jon) 14441
2003-2006 Eichelkraut, Joseph A. (Ike) 14436
2007-2010 Kuwitzky, Carl S. 5904
2011-2012 Chase, Steven J. (Steve) 11329
2013-2014 Richardson, Mark H. 31555
2015 Jackson, Paul J. 23742
2016-2020 Weaks, Jonathan L. (Jon) 14441

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