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Vacuum Pipe Modelling (Negative Pressure) #33218 - 02/17/10 08:01 AM
EEPC Go
Member I am modelling a vacuum pipe system. The pressure in the pipe is 0.050 bara Advanced
Registered: (Absolute Pressure).
05/08/09
Posts: 3
Who's Online
Loc: Turkey
While modelling in caesar i am writing -0.950 bar to the pressure box (Since
caesar works with gauge pressure) and before doing stress anlysis caesar gives 5 registered (WRasco,
error like caesar cannot proceed with negative pressure. EEPC, treysoucie,
Itchy, Rocker), 9
How i will be able model vacum pipes with negative pressure? Guests and 5 Spiders
online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod,
Mod
I will not be able to answer your further questions since i will be out of office
during the day. February
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Waiting for your advices..
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Thanks a lot .. 7 8 9 10 11 12 13
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Re: Vacuum Pipe Modelling (Negative Pressure) [Re: EEPC] #33221 - 02/17/10 08:30 AM 28
Richard Ay Forum Stats
The piping codes do not address negative pressures.
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Texas, USA
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Re: Vacuum Pipe Modelling (Negative Pressure) [Re: Richard Ay] #33222 - 02/17/10 08:45 AM
EEPC
Member So we connot use Caesar II Program to solve vacuum pipe systems?
Registered:
05/08/09 Can we assume positive pressure instead of negative pressure? CAn we model
Posts: 3
Loc: Turkey
0.95 bar internal pressure instead of 0.95 external pressure?
As far as i know the pressure effects only the stress in the pipe.(I mean hoop
stress) so there is no effect in the restraint forces.In my design i only check
Sustain -operating and sismic cases.
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Re: Vacuum Pipe Modelling (Negative Pressure) [Re: EEPC] #33223 - 02/17/10 08:57 AM
1 of 2 17.02.2010 22:49
Vacuum Pipe Modelling (Negative Pressure) - COADE Discussion Forums http://www.coade.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Nu...
Richard Ay
The "hoop stress" equation is rearranged such that you solve for "t", to
Member
determine the pipe thickness. After that, (for process and power piping), the
Registered: hoop stress is not important - it doesn't factor into the "Code Stress".
12/13/99
Posts: 3046
Loc: Houston, Depending on which load case you're talking about, pressure is a component of
Texas, USA the "Code Stress" in some form of "longitudinal pressure stress". Most Codes
define this as PD/4t (although there are more exact forms of this equaiton). So
you basically add PD/4t as a term in the stress equation. If you run with a
negative pressure, the PD/4t term would reduce the "code stress", which is
non-conservative.
In earlier versions of CAESAR II we did allow people to run with negative
pressures, but when the longitudinal pressure stres was computed we used
|P|D/4t, so the term was always positive.
In the last two versions of CAESAR II we changed things to just throw an
error, because we got tired of explaining to people why the software wouldn't
design stiffening rings or address buckling (you can't do that with simple 3D
Beam Elements). In the next version (5.30) we'll probably allow negative
pressures again, but there will be a warning regarding the limitations.
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Richard Ay
COADE, Inc.
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