Wikipedia

Talk:Women in Judaism

(Redirected from Talk:Role of women in Judaism)
Latest comment: 2 years ago by Pngeditor in topic To be removed?
Learn more about this page

Women's prayer groups

edit

The text you propose is the following:

Since women are not allowed to lead services or read from the Torah in Orthodox Jewish synagogues, a small number of Orthodox women have begun holding women's tefila (prayer) groups. While no Orthodox legal authorities agree that women can form a prayer quorum for the purpose of regular services, women in these groups read the prayers, and study Torah. The emergence of this phenomenon has enmeshed Orthodox Judaism in a debate which still continues today. Basically there are three schools of Orthodox thought on this issue.
  • The first school of thought rules the while women do not constitute a minyan, they may still carry out full prayer services. The first Jewish authority who ruled this way was Israel's late Ashkenazic Chief Rabbi, Shlomo Goren, in 1974. he reaffimed this view for 15 years; however after receiving harsh criticism from Haredi rabbis, Rabbi Goren stated that his writing was purely a speculative work published against his wishes, and not intended as a practical responsum. This view is still held by some Orthodox rabbis, such as Avi Weiss and many rabbis associated with Edah.
  • The second school of thought includes leading faculty of Modern Orthodox Judaism's Yeshiva University, and almost all Haredi Rabbis. This school of thought holds that all women's prayer groups are absolutely forbidden by Jewish law.
  • A third school of thought maintains that women's prayer groups can be compatiable with halakha, but only if they do not carry out a full prayer service (i.e. do not include certain parts of the service known as "devarim she-bi-kdusha"), and only if services are spiritually and sincerely motivated; they cannot be sanctioned if they are inspired by a desire to rebel against halakha. People in this school of thought include Rabbis Moshe Feinstein, Joseph Soloveitchik, Avraham Elkana Shapiro, former British Chief Rabbi Immanuel Jakobovits, and Israel's late Ashkenazic Chief Rabbi Shlomo Goren, among others[1] (http://www.daat.ac.il/daat/english/tfila/frimmer1.htm).
Many Orthodox Jewish feminists have taken umbridge at this view, saying that it is inappropriate for men to publicly judge a women's inner intention's, while women are not allowed to judge men's inner intentions. They reject entirely the claim that their are being judged as "rebelling against halakha".

Woman's Prayer Groups- Question Sources

edit
Latest comment: 16 years ago3 comments2 people in discussion

The interpretation of the sources provided for the existence of prayer groups in the middle ages is unsourced original research. The Kol Bo is referring specifically to Tisha Baav- hardly a direct source for the inference of "woman's prayer groups" (which implies normative praying- not the dirges of Tisha Baav). Additionally, it was common practice in the synagogues of Europe for a knowledgeable woman to repeat the prayers out loud for woman who did not know how to pray. However- and this is crucial- these were not separate "woman's groups," but were in the womans section praying with the men! Basically, a regular minyan with the addition of a woman helping out less knowledgeable congregants. Therefore, the interpretation of these sources as referring to separate "woman's prayer groups" is unsourced speculative original research. 38.117.213.19 (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 05:16, 30 March 2008 (UTC)Reply

The source is Grossman, Avraham. Pious and Rebellious: Jewish Women in Medieval Europe. Translated from the Hebrew by Jonathan Chapman. Brandeis University Press, 2004. ISBN 1-58465-392-2. The language is not intended to suggest that what happened in the Middle Ages is precisely the same as what occurs in a contemporary "women's prayer group" or that contemporary groups are successors to the Medieval situation. It is intended only to support that in Medieval Europe, (a) Jewish women prayed in groups separately from men on certain occassions, and (b) it was common for women to lead prayers with respect to other women, and such women were identified specifically as prayer leaders. Both propositions are supported by the source, as you note. We can adjust the language if it implies otherwise. Hope this helps. Best, --Shirahadasha (talk) 19:24, 1 April 2008 (UTC)Reply
We should indeed adjust the language to reflect your above comment. It is worth noting that the term "prayer leader" is loaded. It would imply that a woman led the prayers in a traditional sense i.e. recitation of prayers that require a minyan. I will work on a new draft and post it here for comment before editing the article. 38.117.213.19 (talk) 18:59, 14 August 2008 (UTC)Reply

Role of R Mordechai Kaplan Z'l

edit
Latest comment: 13 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Rabbi Kaplan IIUC conducted the first Bat Mitzvah ceremony, a landmark in Judaism. He did it while he was still associated with JTS, but this is not noted in the Conservative J section, where he is not mentioned at all. In the new Recon section only his actions after founding Recon are mentioned. R Kaplan's career, and its impact on women, started BEFORE he founded Recon, and it seems appropriate to mention it.

Ricardianman (talk) 01:11, 11 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

Debates within Orthodoxy essay

edit
Latest comment: 13 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

What should we do with the Debates within Orthodoxy essay? I don't think we should keep it as it is. Should we dispose of it entirely? I'm not sure how to "rescue" it. Any thoughts? --GHcool (talk) 22:49, 14 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

Editing to Middle Ages

edit
Latest comment: 11 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

As part of my course, I re-wrote the section on the Middle Ages. If you would like to see the article before my changes, visit http://web.archive.org/web/20121129094615/http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_Judaism I was able to address some of the issues talked about, such as the women's prayer groups. rr9842a (talk) 01:53, 22 April 2013 (UTC)Reply

edit
Latest comment: 9 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 7 external links on Women in Judaism. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers. —cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 12:46, 27 August 2015 (UTC)Reply

edit
Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 9 external links on Women in Judaism. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 17:30, 26 July 2017 (UTC)Reply

edit
Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Women in Judaism. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 02:50, 2 December 2017 (UTC)Reply

defender of modesty

edit
Latest comment: 4 years ago2 comments1 person in discussion

The part in the "Rules of modesty" section that claims, "This is reflective of the women's role in being the historical defender of modesty and the purity of the Jewish people" and speaks about the Golden Calf and the heresy at Peor sounds like a bubbemeise. If it cannot be cited to a reliable source, I propose removing it. --GHcool (talk) 20:12, 11 February 2020 (UTC)Reply

DONE. --GHcool (talk) 18:28, 14 February 2020 (UTC)Reply

To be removed?

edit
Latest comment: 2 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

This statement doesn't seem to relate to Education. The Cairo Geniza is filled with correspondences written (sometimes dictated) between family members and spouses. Many of these letters are pious and poetic and express a desire to be in closer or more frequent contact with a loved one that is far enough away to only be reached by written correspondence. There are also records of wills and other personal legal documents as well as written petitions to officials in cases of spousal abuse or other conflicts between family members written or dictated by women.[1] Perhaps it fits somewhere else, but not in this section.Pngeditor (talk) 12:24, 19 September 2022 (UTC) Pngeditor (talk) 12:24, 19 September 2022 (UTC)Reply

DONE.  Y

References

  1. ^ Melammed, 91–100.
Add topic
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Women_in_Judaism&oldid=1251178237"