Talk:Ismail Haniyeh

Birth date

Some foreign language wikipedias (including the Arabic one) claim he was born in 1962 and Not 1963 like stated now. can anyone verify the correct information? Dberliner 18:19, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Sorry for the late reply... ;-) I fixed it. Our article now says "1962 or 1963". That's the best we can do, given the currently available sources. — Chrisahn (talk) 14:06, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Reason behind his arrests/assassination attempt

Took out the unfootnoted reference regarding his involvement in targeting Israeli civilians. Haniyeh is personally against these attacks and Israeli officials have conceded that they have no evidence of any such involvement. [SEE http://www.counterpunch.org/hass03172006.html]. His arrests were administrative detentions due to the fact he is affiliated with Hamas.

Elimination

This term is terribly draconian, something a cold hearted fascist would use with routine. Political killings are known as 'assassinations', not mere eliminations.

Ismail Haniyeh Assasinated

As reported by the IRGC https://www.iranintl.com/en/202407311462 Ismail Haniyeh has been killed in Tehran. WintermuteKnows (talk) 03:06, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

References

Is it official??? Zundel e (talk) 03:09, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2024/07/30/world/israel-gaza-war-lebanon-hezbollah?smid=url-share#ismail-haniyeh-a-top-hamas-leader-has-been-killed-iran-says 2A02:2F01:6A09:4000:F9D6:D363:8B54:E893 (talk) 03:20, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Thanks Zundel e (talk) 03:23, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 31 July 2024

Add in death date Jul 30 2024. He was just killed. https://x.com/yashar/status/1818481804485312896 69.123.64.3 (talk) 03:07, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

July 31 2024.

"A statement by the IRGC's Public Relations Department said the attack was carried out early Wednesday [...]" – https://www.iranintl.com/en/202407311462 2A02:2F01:6A09:4000:F9D6:D363:8B54:E893 (talk) 03:23, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

 Already done ARandomName123 (talk)^{Ping me!} 03:25, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

assassinated

Hamas's Ismail Haniyeh 'martyred' in Iran - The Jerusalem Post (jpost.com) 2606:9400:8FA0:CBF0:612C:133F:4598:54F (talk) 03:08, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 31 July 2024 (2)

Change reported year of death to 2024 184.145.112.103 (talk) 03:19, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

 Already done - The article has already been updated. - ZLEA _T\^C 03:45, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Death date

Death date is listed as July 30, 2024. Shouldnt this be either UTC or tehran local time, July 31, 2024? Just.some.guy.2468 (talk) 03:35, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Yes, but it seems someone already got to it mere seconds before I was going to change the date. - ZLEA _T\^C 03:40, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Unrelatedly, the name "Barghouti" is misspelt as "Barhgouti" in a link in this article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:8801:9A29:FF00:9DD0:AAF9:472C:307C (talk) 03:57, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 31 July 2024 (3)

Change “is” to “was” in the line “According to a 2014 Ynet article, Haniyeh is a millionaire…” which is under the heading “Personal and family life” 71.184.206.244 (talk) 04:00, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Now that's one of the best edits I've ever had the pleasure of seeing. 2603:9001:300:81A:D486:F646:CF3:6732 (talk) 04:50, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

 Done... Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 04:53, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 31 July 2024 (4)

I would like to add info about Ismail hanyas death Sources: https://edition.cnn.com/2024/07/30/world/video/ismail-haniyeh-death-hamas-political-leader-digvid https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2024/7/31/israels-war-on-gaza-live-israel-hits-beirut-in-assassination-operation https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2024/jul/31/middle-east-crisis-live-updates-hamas-leader-ismail-haniyeh-killed-iran-israel-gaza-war https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2024/7/31/hamass-political-chief-ismail-haniyeh-assassinated-in-iran-state-media TKWGwiki (talk) 05:01, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

I would suggest making a request at the main article instead as both entries about his death are fairly short. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 05:02, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: See the comment above, along with WP:SUMMARYHATNOTE and WP:SYNC, which explain why we have the pages organized this way. Bsoyka (t • c • g) 02:44, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request UNRWA employee

The lead should say that Ismail Haniyeh was an (ex) UNRWA teacher. sources:

https://www.thejc.com/news/israel/hamas-terror-chief-haniyeh-was-an-unwra-teacher-reveals-former-un-official-nvlqbb16 https://www.israeltoday.co.il/read/hamas-chief-haniyeh-was-an-unrwa-school-teacher/ https://www.israelnationalnews.com/news/387304 https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-792791 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 5.22.130.45 (talk • contribs) 06:21, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: those sources got the information from the claims of 1 person as translated by MEMRI whose reliability is "between no consensus and generally unreliable". Rainsage (talk) 22:14, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

The video is in Arabic, you can litterally hear him say "Mu'alem fi al Unrwa, Ismail Haniyeh" (Teacher at (the) Unrwa , Ismail Haniyeh) , there are many Wikipedia editors who know Arabic well enough who could confirm that by watching the actual video from the thejc link. 2A00:C281:1212:7B00:5C69:A009:A9B9:D10B (talk) 13:02, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request UNRWA "airstrike"

The Death section shouldn't mention an airstrike without a source. Both sources say "raid", and one says "strike", but neither source says "airstrike". 12.75.41.13 (talk) 06:54, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

 Already done : Updated with new information – macaddct1984 ^{(talk | contribs)} 18:48, 1 August 2024 (UTC)

Birthdate

He was born in 1963 or 1962? There are conflicting sources. 2A02:B027:8F02:8318:1D71:887E:FA14:4793 (talk) 07:58, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

It's true that sources give conflicting birth years. Best we can say is "1962 or 1963". Done. — Chrisahn (talk) 17:11, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

PSPCR poll

This graph takes an undue size in the article and should be removed. Makeandtoss (talk) 08:20, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

It's not yet confirmed that he was killed by Israel

Until it's confirmed that he was killed in an Israeli airstrike, all guess' like that should be removed from this page. No reputable references confirms this (yet). Wikipedia is just so low quality right now. Please help make this better. 2A02:1406:A:E673:0:0:3993:8785 (talk) 09:32, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Furthermore, it should be an alleged Israeli airstrike, no confirmation has come from IDF. If Hezbollah's strike in Majdal Shams is "alleged" with only Hezbollah's word (and with Israeli and US claiming the opposite), I don't see why this one is so certain. Be consistent, please. 77.137.37.166 (talk) 10:22, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Thank you :) 77.137.37.166 (talk) 10:35, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Still says "by Israel" when no evidence for this was found and no responsibility taken. At least add "presumably" by Israel or "allegedly" though the facts are not clear. 2A0D:6FC2:5351:5800:34A7:461B:C880:EDE5 (talk) 14:50, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

Hamas Leader - more relevant then "Prime Minister of the Palestinian National Authority"

He was the leader of Hamas (terror) organization as his latest role. That title describes him more accurately. Strudelnew (talk) 09:33, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

When he was born?

The New York Times https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/31/world/middleeast/ismail-haniyeh-dead.html and The Washington Post https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/07/31/israel-iran-ismail-haniyeh-killed-tehran-hamas/d5a6682a-4f10-11ef-9728-3037305a6b0f_story.html list his birth as 1962. 188.210.239.4 (talk) 09:52, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

The Washington Post article doesn't mention his birth date or year anymore. There's an addendum: "This article corrects Haniyeh’s age when he died. He was 62." That would mean he was born between 1961-08-01 and 1962-07-31. — Chrisahn (talk) 13:18, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Why not use a clearer image as stated in Wikipedia Image use policy?

In Wikipedia:Image use policy, it states that "The relevant aspect of the image should be clear and central". However the current image is not. The image mentioned below is more suitable. (Source: Arabic Wikipedia).

"03-03-2020 Ismail Haniyeh (cropped).jpg" Ras al Ghoul (talk) 11:34, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 31 July 2024 (5)

Please change text "[...] Haniyeh sent a letter to U.S. President Georg W. Bush" to "[...] Haniyeh sent a letter to U.S. President George W. Bush"

Reason: I presume it's a typo? The Haaretz Article linked as the Source also names him George W. Bush. Noodlesuwu (talk) 12:44, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

References

Thanks! Fixed. — Chrisahn (talk) 13:57, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 31 July 2024 (6)

In the paragraph about his early life it should say ‘became’ instead of ‘become’ 70.66.44.42 (talk) 18:38, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

 Done Jamedeus (talk) 19:32, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Use of questionable source: AlArabiya

Source #89 links to AlArabiya. According to https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/al-arabiya/, this shouldn't be an adequate source for Wikipedia. Explanation on why this is here? 174.93.131.177 (talk) 22:38, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Well, it's not "According to https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/al-arabiya/", it's according to you. Important to get the attribution right when dealing with sources. Source reliability in Wikipedia is not based on what the Media Bias/Fact Check site says. There is a source reliability noticeboard (Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard). It's searchable. Al Arabiya has been discussed several times so you can have look through the archives. Here is an example, Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Noticeboard/Archive_418#Al_Arabiya. Sean.hoyland (talk) 06:55, 1 August 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 1 August 2024

The footnote for the quote "Haniyeh was seen as one of the more pragmatic and moderate figures in Hamas.[12]" at the end of the third paragraph of this article cites a reuters article linked here (https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/obituary-tough-talking-haniyeh-was-seen-more-moderate-face-hamas-2024-07-31/) which simply states the following: "But despite the rhetoric, he was seen by many diplomats as a moderate compared to the more hardline members of the Iran-backed group inside Gaza."

This claim is not substantiated in any way, and Haniyeh was not seen as a moderate.

Here is a video of Ismail Haniyeh praying while watching footage of October 7th, 2023, during which Hamas militants infiltrated Israel and killed thousands of people: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Pm1anGlQSU.

This is not something a moderate would do. This sentence from the third paragraph of this article and its associated footnote should be struck. Thank you. Aristonkle (talk) 13:38, 1 August 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: Reuters is considered generally reliable, and that claim seems to be supported by the article. If you take out some extraneous wording to simplify both quotes you gave, both the article and Reuters say he was seen [...] as [...] moderate. Additionally, as an encyclopedia, Wikipedia doesn't care what's "right" or "wrong" in your eyes or mine. We care what's supported by reliable sources, and this statement is. Finally, YouTube videos are generally unreliable, and your personal interpretation of one is original research, which we don't use in our articles at all. Bsoyka (t • c • g) 02:52, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

This reply @Bsoykadoes not address the conflict between the Reuters article and the conduct being demonstrated by Haniyeh in the video. If your issue with the video is that it is on YouTube given source reliability:

1. Here is the same video from New Delhi TV: https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/not-celebrating-anymore-video-shows-hamas-chiefs-reaction-to-oct-7-attack-6229312

2. An article from the National Post substantiates this by saying "Haniyeh celebrated this heinous act" in reference to October 7th: https://nationalpost.com/opinion/avi-benlolo-ismail-haniyeh-brutalized-israelis-and-betrayed-the-palestinian-people

3. An additional India based source (Wio News) shares the same video of Haniyeh celebrating and prostrating himself during the attacks on October 7th: https://www.wionews.com/world/ismail-haniyeh-assassinated-a-video-of-hamas-leader-watching-oct-7-attacks-on-israel-resurfces-745823

Once again - the third paragraph's ending sentence in the following: "Haniyeh was seen by many diplomats as one of the more pragmatic and moderate figures in Hamas."

The framing of this sentence given the above is not neutral and should be balanced given there are clear examples of him not acting as a "moderate". Aristonkle (talk) 12:45, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

Apologies - intended to tag @Bsoyka Aristonkle (talk) 12:49, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

@Aristonkle: That sourcing looks a little better to me, but there's still nothing there that explicitly states "Haniyeh was not a moderate." I would lean toward supporting a change like "Some sources saw Haniyeh as a more moderate figure in Hamas, while others commented on his celebration in October 2023 of the Hamas-led attack on Israel," but I'll let someone else finish this review off who's a bit more familiar with the subject. As required by our edit request process, I recommend you suggest the specific text you'd like to add with complete citations. (However, I might recommend leaving the National Post article out, as that seems to be an opinion piece.) Bsoyka (t • c • g) 13:30, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for your reply @Bsoyka.

My suggested edit is the following given the above input and back and forth: "Some sources saw Haniyeh as a more moderate figure in Hamas, while others commented on his celebration in October 2023 of the Hamas-led attack on Israel."

Additional citations for the above:

1. Newsweek: https://www.newsweek.com/ismail-haniyeh-hamas-moderate-iran-israel-palestine-1932708

2. Memri: https://www.memri.org/reports/egyptian-writer-dalia-ziada-hamas-leader-haniyeh-was-not-moderate-politician-murderous Aristonkle (talk) 18:50, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

<- Aristonkle is not extended confirmed. They can submit edit requests. They can't participate in consensus forming discussions as appears to be the case here. Sorry Aristonkle, those are the rules under WP:ARBECR. Sean.hoyland (talk) 04:02, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Can you please point me to the specific language in the rules that states that non-extended confirmed members cannot participate in consensus forming discussions? The link you provided states the following @Sean.hoyland:

"The Committee may apply the "Reliable source consensus-required restriction" to specified topic areas. For topic areas with this restriction, when a source that is not an article in a peer-reviewed scholarly journal, an academically focused book by a reputable publisher, and/or an article published by a reputable institution is removed from an article, no editor may reinstate the source without first obtaining consensus on the talk page of the article in question or consensus about the reliability of the source in a discussion at the Reliable Sources Noticeboard. Administrators may enforce this restriction with page protections, topic bans, or blocks; enforcement decisions should consider not merely the severity of the violation but the general disciplinary record of the editor in violation."

The rules also say the following:

"The Committee may apply the "extended confirmed restriction" to specified topic areas. When such a restriction is in effect in a topic area, only extended-confirmed editors may make edits related to the topic area, subject to the following provisions:

1. The restriction applies to all edits and pages related to the topic area, broadly construed, with the following exceptions:
   1. Non-extended-confirmed editors may use the "Talk:" namespace only to make edit requests related to articles within the topic area, provided they are not disruptive. Should disruption occur on "Talk:" pages, administrators may take enforcement actions described in "B" or "C" below.
   2. Non-extended-confirmed editors may not create new articles, but administrators may exercise discretion when deciding how to enforce this remedy on article creations. Deletion of new articles created by non-extended-confirmed editors is permitted but not required.
2. If a page (other than a "Talk:" page) mostly or entirely relates to the topic area, broadly construed, this restriction is preferably enforced through extended confirmed protection, though this is not required.
3. On any page where the restriction is not enforced through extended confirmed protection, this restriction may be enforced by other methods, including page protection, reverts, blocks, the use of pending changes, and appropriate edit filters.
4. Reverts made solely to enforce this restriction are not considered edit warring."

Nowhere does this say that I can't participate in consensus building discussions. I have provided ample sources that @Bsoyka has states as being reliable to support improving the balanced nature of the sentence in the article that I am stating should be edited. Aristonkle (talk) 12:52, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Sure, "Non-extended-confirmed editors may use the "Talk:" namespace only to make edit requests related to articles". Also, see above where Bsoyka helpfully informed you "As required by our edit request process, I recommend you suggest the specific text you'd like to add with complete citations." So, in a nutshell, there is a simple and easy to follow rule, non-EC editors are limited to submitting edit requests until they become extendedconfirmed. If you would like further information, I suggest you ask admin ScottishFinnishRadish. I'm sure you will have no trouble whatsoever following this rule. Why would anyone have any trouble following the rule? Sean.hoyland (talk) 13:14, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

I have no problem following the rule. I suggested the edit above:

"My suggested edit is the following given the above input and back and forth: "Some sources saw Haniyeh as a more moderate figure in Hamas, while others commented on his celebration in October 2023 of the Hamas-led attack on Israel." Aristonkle (talk) 17:17, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

{{nobold|{{lang|ar|{{Script/Arabic|إسماعيل هنية}}|rtl=yes}} }}

Do we really need this many layers of templates on the name in the info box? {{nobold|{{lang|ar|{{Script/Arabic|إسماعيل هنية}}|rtl=yes}} }} The info box asks for "native_name_lang", so I think it mighty be doing anything needed already? FourPi (talk) 11:29, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

Assassination is still not claimed to be done by any country.

Why does it even say that the assassination was by Israel? It's a speculation at the moment, as no one has claimed responsibility. It should be changed to just assassinated by an unknown assailant… Or something. TheMushyCrazs (talk) 13:45, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

"Means, motive, opportunity", as they say. AnonMoos (talk) 20:55, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

Those belong in a court of law. Which Wikipedia is not. This is just a blatant break in WP:NPOV. It should be changed to "allegedly", rather than "likely", which is entirely the opinion of the editor; and not present in any of the three sources, as far as I can see. 77.137.37.166 (talk) 12:07, 4 August 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 2 August 2024

His remains were already transported to Doha and his funeral prayers were completed. Ali1079 (talk) 19:03, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

@Ali1079, I don't see a problem with adding this. But it will be done more quickly if you can provide a link to a suitable source? And it would also help to suggest exactly where on the page it needs to be added. FourPi (talk) 03:34, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Lede - Perpetrator

The lede to the article currently states "On 31 July 2024, Haniyeh was assassinated by an explosive device planted in his guesthouse in Tehran by likely Israeli Mossad agents." The latter part which accuses "Israeli Mossad agents" has no foundation in any of the given sources, nor is its likelihood determined. It furthermore does not correctly summarize the section Death, nor the contents of the article Assassination of Ismail Haniyeh. It is confusing why the editor would add what appears to be a personal opinion that is not supported by the RS.

My request is that this part of the line be changed to indicate an alleged implication, if not removed at all.

77.137.37.166 (talk) 13:22, 4 August 2024 (UTC)

please provide x to y change with proper rs Golaecan (talk) 19:13, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

References

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 7 August 2024

Change "On 31 July 2024, Haniyeh was assassinated by an explosive device planted in his guesthouse in Tehran, likely by Israeli Mossad agents." to On 31 July 2024, Haniyeh was assassinated by a short range projectile launched from outside his residence in Tehran, likely by Israeli Mossad agents." 64.180.206.245 (talk) 17:04, 7 August 2024 (UTC)

That's the opposite of what the Jewish Chronicle says. AnonMoos (talk) 18:04, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 8 August 2024

In "personal life," there is a reference to a 2014 Ynet article asserting that Haniyeh was a millionaire. But according to more recent reports, he was worth $4 billion.

https://mackenzieinstitute.com/2023/11/hamass-top-leaders-are-worth-billions-heres-how-they-continue-to-grow-rich/

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/ismail-haniyeh-net-worth-2024-062649649.html?guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAGcL060T3NgvEWE1LesTSKPKpDdV07ijm2tnWg84a91EF-GLtdbEN6SmMk4GK6nHcSZHeI1O4JBOy8bcVoT4fj5ZoRY39_rgH_GsC1ypYapOs7mUv_U1L7gpxOXftW7jaaqRAENe3909Q9fAfp1KEZTdzV6zbj7fstR9W8D1I-LC&guccounter=2#:~:text=Ismail%20Haniyeh%20had%20an%20estimated,activities%20linked%20to%20his%20position Ajkoller (talk) 18:57, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Rainsage (talk) 03:10, 11 September 2024 (UTC)