Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2008 April 21: Difference between revisions

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===[[Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2008 April 21|21 April 2008]]===

 

Subject is clearly notable [[User:NewsGuru|NewsGuru]] ([[User talk:NewsGuru|talk]]) 23:52, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

 

*'''Restore''' - While the article did not indicate the importance/significance of its subject all too clearly, I don't think that an article with 4 sources should be [[Wikipedia:Criteria for speedy deletion|speedy deleted]] under [[WP:CSD#A7|criterion A7]], especially when some of the sources are [[Wikipedia:Reliable sources|reliable]]. In any case, an article about a chief correspondent for [[NBC News]] and winner of an [[Emmy Award]] needs more consideration (i.e. [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion|AfD]]) – if it should be deleted at all, that is. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' ^{([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])} 01:16, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

*'''Restore''' a very poor speedy. Asserting a national correspondent for major networks is assertion of importance enough to pass speedy, referenced or unreferenced. with the references, it should be enough to pass AfD as well. I notice the deleting admin has deleted 81 articles in the last 24 hours; Fellow admins may want to review them. I have notified him of this discussion. '''[[User:DGG|DGG]]''' ([[User talk:DGG|talk]]) 14:56, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

 

 

The reasons for deletion given by nominator no longer exist. At least 4 out of 5 references are valid sources according to [[WP:N]], and after they were added there were no more votes. So I don't understand the ruling of the closing administrator. I was sure the AfD procedure is not a majority vote, otherwise any attempt to improve the article during such procedure would be just pure waste of time. Please reconsider relisting it one more time. [[User:Greg park avenue|greg park avenue]] ([[User talk:Greg park avenue|talk]]) 21:39, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

:From closing admin, copied from [[User talk:BanyanTree#M4+2 engine]]: "Later AFD participants had a chance to evaluate the journal article, which appears to be the strongest support for notability, and still thought it merited deletion. I looked over the web-based articles and none appeared to have the weight of a journal article. (The cosmetic changes obviously don't establish notability, neither does the patent link as nobody is disputing that it exists.) I am satisfied that this is an accurate reading of the consensus." Note that I suggested DRV if the user remained unsatisfied. [[User:BanyanTree|Banyan]][[User talk:BanyanTree|Tree]] 22:02, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

::How do you know what participants in the AfD discussion later think? You must just be a mindreader, are you?. And it is not true what you suspect or speculate; for example: [[User:JeremyMcCracken]] acknowledged in the AfD discussion that he was not for deletion (forgetting that he was the first one to vote for it) but for notability or its lack, but he suspected that notability has been reached after the article had been significantly improved (not just cosmetic changes you have implied), still he can't handle Polish. Can you? Yet you sound like you can handle this but I don't think you can handle this, having been an expert in the field of engineering notwithstanding. That's why I tagged this article with the "expert" template hoping the participitants in the discussion and closing admin will have at least BA in this area of expertise or something close, but obviously those are in demand here in Wikipedia. That should answer your question why no one took part in this discussion after proper references were added. If it was an obvious hoax or advertisement or autobiography, many Polish-American Wikipedians who are active here would cry wolf and vote for deletion. But they kept their distance since they're mostly historians and just would not like to interfere. And I just asked for another re-listing after which one new faces always appear, not for argument who is right or who is not. Thanks! [[User:Greg park avenue|greg park avenue]] ([[User talk:Greg park avenue|talk]]) 23:14, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

:*Just saved it by pure premonition it would be deleted. Now I am recreating it in unabridged version [[M4+2 engine/Temporary]]. Hope, didn't break any rules. Subject to speedy deletion after this review is resolved. [[User:Greg park avenue|greg park avenue]] ([[User talk:Greg park avenue|talk]]) 00:57, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

::*I've deleted the [[M4+2 engine/Temporary|temporary page]] for now; since it doesn't preserve the edit history of the original article, it violates the [[GFDL]] license. If you'd like to work on the article, its content (and page history) could be restored and moved to a subpage of your [[Wikipedia:User pages|user page]]... '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' ^{([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])} 01:22, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

:::*OK, I have created a subpage on my [[User:Greg park avenue]] page titled "M4+2 engine/Temp" ([http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Greg_park_avenue#Subpages] and I would like to restore this article here together with its history, don't know how to do it though. Hope you can help. Sorry for violating GFDL, didn't mean that. Thanks! [[User:Greg park avenue|greg park avenue]] ([[User talk:Greg park avenue|talk]]) 02:04, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

::::*No worries. :) I've moved the article's content and history to [[User:Greg park avenue/M4+2 engine]] (basically, I undeleted the article and [[WP:MM|moved]] it to a subpage of your user page). Cheers, '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' ^{([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])} 02:18, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

 

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[[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Magic: The Gathering rules (2nd nomination)|This AFD]] was closed as no-consensus, the discussion concerning whether this fell under [[WP:GAMEGUIDE]] was somewhat controversial. I'm not arguing against the decision that this didn't fufil the criteria to be deleted under GAMEGUIDE, but that considering the nature of the AfD, I'm requesting that it be re-opened and re-listed to garner additional discussion. '''[[User:Mr Senseless|Mister Senseless]]&trade;''' ([[User_talk:Mr Senseless|Speak]] - [[Special:Contributions/Mr_Senseless|Contributions]]) 21:26, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

 

* As the closing admin, I'm not in principle opposed to a relist, if people here think this might yet yield a "delete" consensus – but I think this is not very likely. Could you explain why you think otherwise? (For future reference, it's more polite to ask the closing admin first instead of going straight to DRV.) [[User:Sandstein|Sandstein]] ([[User talk:Sandstein|talk]]) 21:37, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

*'''Endorse''' - not an obviously wrong close. If the nominator remains concerned then a relist is the way to go. [[User:BlueValour|BlueValour]] ([[User talk:BlueValour|talk]]) 23:52, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

:*I personally just felt that the discussion wasn't as through as it could be, I'm still sort of new here, but now I know next time that a relist in a few weeks would have been more appropriate. Sorry for wasting your time guys, I'm perfectly fine with withdrawing this! '''[[User:Mr Senseless|Mister Senseless]]&trade;''' ([[User_talk:Mr Senseless|Speak]] - [[Special:Contributions/Mr_Senseless|Contributions]]) 00:50, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

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:* I was the only person who voted to keep based on my opinion, the others supplied reasons and evidence of notability. So there is still at least 2 voters (Eastmain and Grand Roi) with various evidence of notability, whereas the people wanting to delete just said - no evidence of notability, though it has been proven that it is notable, so they are wrong to delete it. [[User:Rigsy05|Rigsy05]] ([[User talk:Rigsy05|talk]]) 12:21, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

*'''Overturn'''. I added a book review from the Yorkshire Evening Post at http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/book-reviews/Centurion-.3905940.jp just before the article was deleted, and I was about to add one from the Coventry Telegraph, http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/whats-on-coventry-warwickshire/book-reviews-and-news/2008/04/21/centurion-by-simon-scarrow-headline-12-99-92746-20794309/ , and I think that would have been enough to establish notability. Besides, the book was on the Sunday Times bestseller list (not a notability criterion, but a strong hint that the book might be notable). --[[User:Eastmain|Eastmain]] ([[User talk:Eastmain|talk]]) 19:21, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

:*What he said ^^ [[User:Rigsy05|Rigsy05]] ([[User talk:Rigsy05|talk]]) 09:27, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

*'''Relist at AfD''' - One of the sources (the [[Yorkshire Evening Post]] review) was added just five minutes before the AfD was closed, and there is apparently at least one other source. Since neither the arguments for keeping nor those for deleting were especially decisive or overwhelming, relisting the article at AfD to permit evaluation of the new sources would be appropriate, in my opinion. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' ^{([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])} 01:44, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

*'''Relist''' on the basis of the review and the best seller status. That it was a Sunday Times Best seller was present in the article from the beginning, and mentioned in the discussion. The !keep votes were in large part based on that, and that is soundly grounded in policy. The close seems to have been made without proper consideration of either the discussion or the final state of the article. '''[[User:DGG|DGG]]''' ([[User talk:DGG|talk]]) 15:11, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

 

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I'm going to begin working on cleaning up all of the pages related to the [[Myst]] franchise. I'm hoping to salvage what I can from these deleted articles and incorporate the information into the proper page. I am requesting an undeletion for temporary review. If approved, please place on my User subpage: [[User:OranL/Releeshahn]] -- [[User:OranL|OranL]] ([[User talk:OranL|talk]]) 16:44, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

 

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I'm going to begin working on cleaning up all of the pages related to the [[Myst]] franchise. I'm hoping to salvage what I can from these deleted articles and incorporate the information into the proper page. I am requesting an undeletion for temporary review. If approved, please place on my User subpage: [[User:OranL/Saavedro]] -- [[User:OranL|OranL]] ([[User talk:OranL|talk]]) 16:44, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

 

 

 

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I'm going to begin working on cleaning up all of the pages related to the [[Myst]] franchise. I'm hoping to salvage what I can from these deleted articles and incorporate the information into the proper page. I am requesting an undeletion for temporary review. If approved, please place on my User subpage: [[User:OranL/Bahro (Myst)]] -- [[User:OranL|OranL]] ([[User talk:OranL|talk]]) 16:44, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

 

 

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I'm going to begin working on cleaning up all of the pages related to the [[Myst]] franchise. I'm hoping to salvage what I can from these deleted articles and incorporate the information into the proper page. I am requesting an undeletion for temporary review. If approved, please place on my User subpage: [[User:OranL/Terahnee]] -- [[User:OranL|OranL]] ([[User talk:OranL|talk]]) 16:44, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

 

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I'm going to begin working on cleaning up all of the pages related to the [[Myst]] franchise. I'm hoping to salvage what I can from these deleted articles and incorporate the information into the proper page. I am requesting an undeletion for temporary review. If approved, please place on my User subpage: [[User:OranL/Garternay]] -- [[User:OranL|OranL]] ([[User talk:OranL|talk]]) 16:44, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

 

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I'm going to begin working on cleaning up all of the pages related to the [[Myst]] franchise. I'm hoping to salvage what I can from these deleted articles and incorporate the information into the proper page. I am requesting an undeletion for temporary review. If approved, please place on my User subpage: [[User:OranL/D'ni kings]] -- [[User:OranL|OranL]] ([[User talk:OranL|talk]]) 16:44, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

 

 

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