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From: jcm@hgc.edu (James McKim)
Subject: Re: Comparison of languages for CS1 and CS2
Message-ID: <1995Jul16.154114.3556@merlin.hgc.edu>
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References: <3u602v$ao9@source.asset.com> <DBq0w6.9zv@lazrus.cca.rockwell.com> <bob-1507951129430001@comp_ctr245.sonoma.edu>
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Date: Sun, 16 Jul 1995 15:41:14 GMT
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Xref: glinda.oz.cs.cmu.edu comp.edu:13351 comp.lang.ada:32762 comp.lang.c++:138838 comp.lang.modula2:12096 comp.lang.scheme:13228

In article <bob-1507951129430001@comp_ctr245.sonoma.edu> bob@cs.sonoma.edu (Robert G. Plantz) writes:
>In article <DBq0w6.9zv@lazrus.cca.rockwell.com>,
>MLC@IBERIA.CCA.ROCKWELL.COM wrote:
>
><snip>
>
>> Mr. Bishop is correct.  See L.F. Johnson's article
>> "C in the First Course Considered Harmful",
>> in the Technical Opinion section of the May 1995 Communications of the
>> ACM (v.38, n.5, pp.99-101)
>
>I read the article, plus the Technical Opinion section of the June issue.
>All I see in there are *opinions*. Opinions are just fine, and I would
>most definitely like to agree with Mr. Bishop. But I presented some
>very rough evidence that contradicts this opinion, and I have yet
>to see any evidence that supports it.

I know of one pretty careful study comparing the relative merits between
Eiffel and C++ as a first programming language. 

[Thomas94] R. Thomas, ``Experiences with Eiffel and C++ in Teaching Object
Oriented Programming," {\it Proceedings of Technology of Object Oriented Languages and
Systems 15}, 133 -- 140, Prentice Hall, Englewood Cliffs, New Jersey, 1994.\\[.125in]

They used Eiffel in CS1 for two years, then switched to C++ for two
years. They carefully documented how much time they spent on each topic,
down to 10 minute intervals. The result: It took two more weeks (out of
a 14 week term) to cover a suitable subset of C++ than to cover all 
of Eiffel. In the Eiffel version of the course they spent those two weeks
going deeper into design and generic programming issues. Not surprisingly,
as a result of this study, they are seriously considering a return to Eiffel
in CS1.


[...]

>
>Bob Plantz


Hope this helps,
-- Jim
-- 

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